car scam?!

[teknoboi]

Hey fellas,

Was wondering if any of this has happened to you.
Long story short, trying to sell my 350z.
Guy messages really keen about it. Day before he comes sees it. He asks if I will take bank cheque. I responded with cash preferably. He goes on to saying bank cheque is as good as cash and can't be cancelled. The reason why he couldn't get the cash to me is the police and union branch says they don't have that much cash there and they need to order it in and it will be Monday till he can get cash. I called up police and nurses union to find out how a bank cheque from them can be cancelled simply be filling in a form even after the cheque has been given away. This guy only wants to deal on weekends? Possibly the ploy so I can't cash the cheque in. Anyways it smelt fishy all over so I told him I can wait till the cash is in my hands. But he's reluctant now as he needs a car this weekend so my car is off the "tables "
What a mumpet. Has anyone sold a car, gone to cash the cheque in and found it to be worthless?

[Satan]

sounds like a mumpet to me

[JME]

He can pay with bank cheque, and once it clears he can take delivery of the vehicle. Common sense tells you it sounds shifty. Trust that instinct.

[n1ghth4wk]

Maybe he works late on weekdays. Maybe he doesn't want to carry around like $20,000 cash. I wouldn't be handing over that much cash to you either when you can turn around and say where's the proof you handed it over afterwards.

[mARC]

Banks work on what's called the fractional reserve system with one of these variables being they only need to have X percentage of total holdings at hand at any given time.

All a customer needs to do is call up the bank in advance and let them know they will be needing to make X withdrawal on X day when large sums are concerned as this gives said branch the ability to have the cash on hand without hampering estimated daily physical withdrawals.

In regards to receiving a bank cheque from a random on a weekend, no-way-no-how! If they want to pay by bank cheque in any situation refer to JMEs' post.

[shifted]

There are banks that are open on weekends....

Mate bought a Supra a couple weeks ago, went to the bank on Saturday with the owner and sorted it on the spot, keys changed hands and formed signed and sorted.

Depends on your bank - if they aren't willing to go to the bank either though then stay away.

[huggy_b]

^ As above - deposit cheque, once it clears into your account, release the car. Pretty simple.

[j3rk]

Have always bought/sold cars with bank cheques. As noted, drive/ meet for handover at bank on a Saturday.

[EVLO]

most banks have branches open in shopping centre's on saturdays.. meet him at the shops, got into the bank and deposit his cheque and pay for it to clear as fast as possible. Once done and you have the receipt hand over the keys and signed transfer papers. I did it this way for both my 350z and Ducati i sold a few months back... simple..

[TJ]

Here is my bsb and account number, transfer funds in front of me

Thanks.

[c.rusli]

Here is my bsb and account number, transfer funds in front of me

Thanks.

The person still able to cancel the transfer, if the transfer was not yet finalised ie. money in your bank.
simply by just calling up the bank.

This is apply the same way as a cheque.

I bought and sold many cars over the years, my preferred method of payment is by cold hard Cash
but if they insisted by using cheque and bank deposit, I'll wait for that money to appear on my bank before I hand over the keys.

[EVLO]

expecting cash for anything near 20k or more is unrealistic imo. As a buyer no way am i walking around with that kind of cash for a day or so, and as a seller i don't want to have to sit there and count it all out and make sure there are no fakes in amongst it all.. meet at a bank, everyone walks away happy...

[satch]

Banks generally take money out of the account once bank cheque is created, so it no longer sits in the persons account. Banks might be open on the weekend but still takes between 2-3 days for cheque to clear.

[shifted]

Banks generally take money out of the account once bank cheque is created, so it no longer sits in the persons account. Banks might be open on the weekend but still takes between 2-3 days for cheque to clear.

Personal cheque made out to seller name should clear straight away.

It has in all my dealings with buying cars.

[AdN]

i have accepted bank cheques before with no issues, i dont think they can issue them without the funds available so atleast you know they have the money.

i have also paid $30k for a car in cash and it does fill both cargo pockets.

[Jmoore]

Pretty sure you can't cancel a bank cheque willy nilly.

AFAIK you can either present the original cheque back to them to have it cancelled OR report it as being lost or stolen.

In the latter, the bank will put a hold on the money and then investigate, if you have cashed the cheque that is in your name into your account then its going to be a few more days of stuffing around but eventually it will clear.

The real issues you have to worry about with a bank cheque is that the cheque is fake or that the money has been taken from a stolen account.

Police and Nurses are open Saturday Morning so you should be able to just go between your banks and sort it all out

[millzy_88]

I was under the impression a bank cheque couldn't be cancelled as well (as the money is taken from your account when you get given it).

I was asked to use one for a car I bought and I took the car away before the cheque had cleared so they obviously trusted this was the case as well.

[EVLO]

you can report the cheque stolen or lost as mentioned above, not sure if the bank will just go ahead and cancel it if they see it has already been banked or if they put a temp hold on it and try contact the person who deposited it first.. at a guess i'd say there is a reasonably hefty fine behind falsely claiming a lost/stolen bank cheque in order to scam someone out of goods....

Also, by the time you are at that point in the transaction you should have their full details on the transfer paper including drivers licence number/address etc.. I ask to see their licence to confirm the details match etc..

[Fukushima]

You are meant to ask these questions after you get ripped off so we can have a detectives thread

[Evilteddy]

You are meant to ask these questions after you get ripped off so we can have a detectives thread with boobs


Fixed...

[teknoboi]

so my question was, has anyone been ripped off this method?
Jmoore/millzt_88 - i did ring police and nurses, and its that easy to cancel a bank cheque even if its been handed over to another person. There's a few banks that allow this. I wouldn't trust a stranger nor a car dealer. Cash is king.

Either way i guess, a heads up to anyone wanting to sell their car to think twice about accepting a bank cheque.

[Adr3naL1N]

have only ever been paid or paid in bank cheque...this is the norm for buying/selling a car.

[EVLO]

i've never known of anyone actually getting a fake cheque/cancelled cheque when selling a car... i'm sure it happens from time to time, but 99.99% you'll be fine.

[REXXXED]

At the end of the day, you have a transfer paper with all their details and you should look at a drivers licence to make sure their details match before accepting it.Personally I see no issue with it, that is how all my cars have been purchased/sold.

If they stooge you and cancel the bank cheque/transfer, you make life very very difficult them very quickly. Police report. Bank investigations etc. I imagine it would be sorted very quickly.

[Nugs]

so my question was, has anyone been ripped off this method?
Jmoore/millzt_88 - i did ring police and nurses, and its that easy to cancel a bank cheque even if its been handed over to another person. There's a few banks that allow this. I wouldn't trust a stranger nor a car dealer. Cash is king.

Either way i guess, a heads up to anyone wanting to sell their car to think twice about accepting a bank cheque.
If Police and Nurses really do make it that easy to cancel then it kind of defeats the purpose of a bank cheque.

[millzy_88]

^^ What he said. This is the whole purpose of the bank cheque. Otherwise it may as well just be a cheque.

[R3N]

^^ What he said. This is the whole purpose of the bank cheque. Otherwise it may as well just be a cheque.

Bank cheque as good as cash? Still takes 3 days to clear, wtf is the point.

[Nugs]

So you don't have to carry and count large amounts of cash.
Imagine standing there counting $60k worth of $50 notes.
I've only ever used a bank cheque or bank transfer.

[j3rk]

$60k is R3Ns daily allowance. He likes to accidentally drop it to lure WF.

[Stig]

Too much paranoia in this thread. Bank Cheque is as good as cash.

Considering a Dealer is willing to give you the keys to a brand new car once you pass them a bank cheque means you don't have to worry about it. Just bank it as soon as possible. Same applies with buying property - bank cheque again!!

A bank cheque is a cheque from A BANK - not an individual. The bank is essentially guaranteeing this money for you.

No need for a tin foil hat.

[crabman]

Bank cheque as good as cash? Still takes 3 days to clear, wtf is the point.

Don't they a one day clear for 60 odd dollars?

[Jmoore]

so my question was, has anyone been ripped off this method?
Jmoore/millzt_88 - i did ring police and nurses, and its that easy to cancel a bank cheque even if its been handed over to another person. There's a few banks that allow this. I wouldn't trust a stranger nor a car dealer. Cash is king.

Either way i guess, a heads up to anyone wanting to sell their car to think twice about accepting a bank cheque.

Gonna have to call you out there...

From the P&N bank PDS:


35. Bank Cheques
a. One of the ways you can withdraw funds from your
account is by requesting a bank cheque. A fee
may apply to the issue of a bank cheque.
b. A bank cheque will be issued under the following
circumstances:
sufficient funds are held in your account at
the time the request is made; or
the appropriate withdrawal form has been
completed.
c. A bank cheque can only be stopped where it has
been lost or stolen, and the P&N Stop Payment/
Indemnity Form has been completed.


Taken from https://pnbank.com.au/PDFDocuments/Product-Disclosure-Statement/Savings-Account-Account-Access-Channels-Product-Disclosure-Statement-PNBank.pdf

So you can report it stolen like every other bank, that doesn't straight up cancel it.

That's some pretty serious levels of fraud as well, way more jail time for such a white collar crime than simply stealing a car.

[teknoboi]

Each to their own, i've sold heaps of cars taking bank cheque, but the main point is his persistence he is unwilling to wait to monday to get cash from his bank. The amount was 15k. In context, he had thursday, friday and saturday to sort it out.

And after ringing P&N bank, they clearly said it can be cancelled even tho the bank cheque has been handed to someone by simply filling out this form:
https://pnbank.com.au/PDFDocuments/Printed-Forms/Stop-Payment-Request-PNBank.pdf

At first instinct, its fishy.

Eitherway rather not sell the car to a dodgy transaction and to deal with the the risk of more headache.

[R3N]

So you don't have to carry and count large amounts of cash.
Imagine standing there counting $60k worth of $50 notes.
I've only ever used a bank cheque or bank transfer.

Not discrediting cheques as a method of payment, referring to bank cheques taking as long as personal cheques to clear. Hence not being like cash in that sense.

[Brett_J]

Most banks will clear it same day if you are nice, ANZ always hook me up with same day clearance.

[200MPH]

Bought a car from a lady who worked for bank west few years back. She would not accept bank cheque! We went to bank, I transferred money to an account, gave her deposit slip, she gave me keys.

So, there is some risk with bank cheque it would seem. Depends on your level of paranoia and the vibe from the person proffering said cheque.

[Stig]

I witnessed a $27m property transaction take place when someone handed over a Bank Cheque and the other party handed over a Certificate of Title. They were standing around a desk in the City and it was all done in 15 minutes.

[dmanvan]

Don't they a one day clear for 60 odd dollars?

used to do it all the time with westpac business banking. it is called 'special answer' $17 , and clears in a day..... basically it means that someone gets onto it that day rather than it sitting on someones tray for a couple of days and then deciding to call and process....

[Crispymk2]

I work at a bike dealership and until the money appears in our account, bank cheque or otherwise, no bike for you.

As soon as it clears, you can have your bike

[waxdass]

^ As above - deposit cheque, once it clears into your account, release the car. Pretty simple.

http://blog.old-and-bold.info/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/meerkat-simples.jpg

[yohoes]

Dont cancel your insurance policy early.. take the bank cheque.. if its fake/gets cancelled whatever the fuck, youre covered

[mARC]

^ Are you sure about that, you willingly handed the keys over, the report would also be willing fraud.

Just to close it out:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihQ1CxY_CGg