Looking to build my first home. After advice, references, info.

[YOUR MATE]

So I've been working and saving my ass off for months after deciding to get a place and I'm at a point now where I have a decent deposit and am ready to go.
Looked at buying established but can't find anything I like for the money being asked of it, so have turned to building. Looking at building on a 600sq/m block in Forrestfield.

I don't need to be told it's a better investment buying closer to the city or that it's a shithole. I grew up here, family lives around here and it's 15 minutes for my brother and I to get to work, and he's going to be living with me. What I'm after is any horror stories or praise people have for builders. Who to use and who not to etc. Dale Alcock has a place I quite like but it's right up there budget wise after making some adjustments. Collier Homes on the other hand has said they can do us a custom design working in a second ensuite etc, and have it finished to the same spec as the DA place ( including air con, floor and window coverings, tiling etc) for less. The rooms are also bigger, but have read some average reviews of them.

Any guidance or opinions (and hookups :D ) would be awesome. Looking to spend around 450-500, block will be 250 of that.

Cheers!

[INSINR8R]

I too would also like to know this as my fiancée and I are keen on said Dale Alcock home and are close to signing on the dotted line.

Block is also in Forrestfield, nice 605sqm. Plans are prepared and they are raring to go.

[mr_mike]

We built thru homebuyers everything went sweet as no dramas at all. Dunno if we just got lucky or what but was 9mths from first sit down with them to handing keys over.

One thing tho try make sure the block has titles released before u sign shit, 3 friends have recently built or are building and all 3 have had major hold ups in the vicinity of 12mths waitin for titles. That's before any construction can start.

[DT95WA]

Avoid Homebuyers Centre. nothing but fucken dramas. couple walls don't line up, must of got the end of the roll for carpet. Argued with the site supervisor about the finish of the white plaster throughout the house. Lots of scratches and swirl marks thru it. he told me to seal all the walls and that will hide most of them. so spent the next 2 days fucking around sealing the walls. called him back to check it out again as it looks worse then before i started. the pingpingpingping went on holidays. His boss ended up coming up to inspect and said because i sealed it before they could fix it, I'm on the own with it. Ended up just doing a handover as is because we had to be out of the rental that week.

Haven't heard any dramas from Dale Alcock homes, probably why they cost a bit more.

[thrtytwo]

Most builders will have good and bad stories. Although some will obviously just be poor quality.

And everything they do wrong, is <i>your fault</i>

Just make sure whoever you go with, that when you make changes to the plan you are very specific. Make sure you are confident that they have understood you. And make sure it ends up on paper.

I'm using content living (about 2 weeks away from handover) and everyone except the builders are shit. Constantly blowing smoke up my ass about everything. No one ever knows anything, they always have to ask a supervisor and get back to you. Fucking annoying.

But the construction is all good, and once tradies are actually on site the work happens quickly.

[Crispymk2]

Mate of mine works for BGC/Commodore Homes so if you like any of their plans/display homes let me know and I'll get him to look after you.

http://www.commodorehomes.com.au/?product_type=undefined

[Aristoman]

Go with Homestart built 4 houses via them. Fully optioned and you get carpets / alarm basically a fully finished house. Part of the BGC group which you'll find is most of the builders out there are affiliated with them.

Unfortunately with most builders its the tradies / contractors that you get which can do slapdash jobs.

All part of the process going around with the supervisor & finding all the faults :p

[catchya]

How much of your budget have you allocated for finishing your home?

Ive built with Plunkett, Ross North, Dale Alcock over the years and are curruntly building with Content Living. Its the supervisor that makes the builder and the transition between stages smooth. Out of these 4, Dale Alcock was 76000 dearer for the same home, same finshings etc. Content Living offered the best value by far. For repeat business, Content Living, Ross North!!
In picking your home, find a block in size and width that will fit without modification making yourself as open to as many plan variables as possible. Pick a North facing block. You will be getting a Euro rated 6 star home and your plan will be processed through a computer that will generate where the windows go etc... to satisfy the Euro star rating.
When modifying a house plan, try and not change the roof dimension by adding to it. This will certainly blow the budget no matter which building company has it!
In today terms, Forrestfield is close to Perth and quite central for movements going North, South, East and West.

[RoarPwr]

All i will say about building your first home is make sure you use a building inspector at every stage of the build... budget about $2k for this as it will cover pretty much every inspection at each stage of the build...

Have the inspection done before each stage payment, that way you have levergae with the builder to get the repairs done... a recent friend of a friend has used the buidling inspector i recommended and the guy picked up 6 breaches of aus standards and over 30 items that were either wrong or not complete... they are now going through the housing claims court or some mediation thing to get things fixed but they are def likely to win due to the inspection reports... bit of a csb... but this was a major buidling company...

The mob i used was Housespect... it was definitley worth the money...as people not in the know generally miss things... these guys pick up on everything...

[mr_rotary]

Pick a North facing block. You will be getting a Euro rated 6 star home and your plan will be processed through a computer that will generate where the windows go etc... to satisfy the Euro star rating.Not quite correct. Pick a floor plan that suits the block. Whatever side of the block that is North is jack shit if you do not having the living areas facing the northern direction. Euro rated? never heard of that before in the building industry! You home will be rated through a 'program' (First Rate, Accurate etc) so as to meet the minimum requirements of the NCC energy efficiency requirements which are currently minimum 6 stars. The program does NOT determine for you to place the windows, rather you need to reposition and re-size the windows for the best outcome. This is only one of many variables to your home in order to meet your minimum 6 stars if the house does not alreay rate. Your design may not rate to start off with due to orientation, changes to the plans etc. The 6 star rating is only 1 of 3 ways in order to meet the min. NCC requirements.

[Risk10k]

Build in the hills, we can look down on the scum together.

[ASSASIN]

Like roarpwr said make sure you inspect constantly along the way, If you try get things repaired or finished when the house is done you will have no chance, Its allot easier for it to be done when the builders are there. Don't let them talk you into anything that you have not discussed with someone in the buisness like a building inspector or a friend that is a builder. I would not go near any BGC homes, Their products are not to the same standards as well anybody else. Redink homes have a really good name and the quality is up there for an off the shelf home.

[Sebdullah]

having just finished building my own place happy to give any sort of advice I can but in all honesty didnt have any major dramas. I used blueprint homes as Rob (prototype) works for them & yeah everything was easy (have yet to have it inspected but I cant imagine too many things turning up)

[2jzlux]

I used content for mine(2 years ago) and it all went pretty smooth
I would definately get a building inspector as mentioned before because they are not emotionally attached to the house and can spot flaws that you never knew were there.
When you are doing the handover you can get a bit excited and miss a lot of small shit that is wrong due to the rush to get in.
If i had to do it again i would definately use an inspector.

Also make sure you get as much conduit through your walls as you can because you will use them and once the plaster is on its hard to get shit put through the walls.

Also get your garage raised and widened, will cost 2-3k but a normal size car is a tight squeeze in garages these days and the extra room is awesome.

[carlos spicy wener]

i haven't built a house but we have done some jobs with dale alcock. i would strongly suggest against using them. they are expensive for a reason, and their build quality is not one of them.
i would steer clear of homebuyers as well, have heard too many bad things about them.

[mr_rotary]

I would definately get a building inspector as mentioned before because they are not emotionally attached to the house and can spot flaws that you never knew were there.
A few people here are suggesting to use building inspectors however they are not the be all. Seeing what these guys pick up on is like the cops giving your car a yellow sticker saying your car is too low when it is stock. Some stuff is legit while other items you just shake your head at.



Also make sure you get as much conduit through your walls as you can because you will use them and once the plaster is on its hard to get shit put through the walls.

Also get your garage raised and widened, will cost 2-3k but a normal size car is a tight squeeze in garages these days and the extra room is awesome.
Conduits help on internal walls, external walls are not required due to the cavity. Builders will just make the garage size as big as they legally need to be so an extra 500mm in width and depth certainly helps. If you own a 4WD take measurements and make sure not only the door opening is wide enough but the head height to the garage door as well. Planning a hoist? Make sure the slab is thicker (150mm) to take it! Reo is not necessary but helps. Some builders also skimp on the depth of concrete to the garage.

[YOUR MATE]

Some helpful replies so far. Awesome. I was hoping someone would of had experience with Collier as the guy I spoke to seemed great and the plans I really like, but after checking out a few other builders mentioned I am glad I havent rushed into anything. One thing I'm noticing is everywhere seems cheaper than Dale Alcock for an off the shelf sort of thing. Which is a shame, as myself and Adrian both really like one of their layouts.

I have no problem spending extra for inspections during the process. If I'm sinking that sort of money into somewhere I plan on living for a while I want it to be perfect, or as close to as possible. A larger garage was already something we would be asking for after 26 years of living somewhere where the garage is 5cm too short to take my car. There will be space this time haha.

How much we have left to finish the house/yard depends on the plans we end up going with. We can comfortably get by with a 3x2 with theatre. Seeing most of these places will do a 4x2 with theatre, study and games for the 200k mark or just over, we could have up to 50k.

[mr_rotary]

Can't say I have looked at Dales but they are more of a premium builder. Some things you may be paying for could be spec level, volume (not m2 area) such as coffered/higher ceilings, better elevations, more choices at pre-start to types of materials used in construction such as better windows, cabinet makers, etc. It's funny when people compare floor plans when there is a LOT more to it than just that. It's like trying to argue why an entry level BMW costs more than a Commodore.

[HANS YOLO]

i built with Ventura Homes (slightly premium...good price/great product but not baller spec) - Absolute dream run from start to finish. I even had the guy who drew mine up contact me months after it was all over to see how i was travelling...champs!

Everyone says they have drama with builders but i can't recommend these guys enough...they were fantastic. My house is now being put forward for HIA Award in its category :)

[HANS YOLO]

ps - if you want to design your own and then shop the plans around, i can put you in touch with some designers/drafties to get it done.

[Denver]

Using blue print homes to do mine, as are a few others, rob aka prototype is your sales rep to speak to there, he should be back in the country in the next week or so from his honeymoon, drop me a pm if you want his number..

So far so good on my build, haven't picked any issues thus far that have caused concern and build seems to be spot on, has gone pretty quick too, but i managed to get lucky with the weather as the majority of the build, and anything that means people knock off if it rains done before wet weather kicked in..

Heard a lot of bad stuff about Dales Alcock in the past, but not sure about these days..

[cplagz]

Brendan, happy to have a chat with you if you get some more questions .etc Currently managing 2 builders doing 11 builds so have learnt a thing or two.

[Drift_R32]

Dealt with supervisors from Scott park,homestart,west Australian housing centre, broadway homes, Webb brown neaves, domination homes, pretty much every builder in the Abn group and BGC group,

As far as first homes go..
Keep on eye on everything, and if your not happy

Get pictures and do everything in writing And take it up immediately.

Some of the supervisors are completely and utterly retarded.
And because they are project builders who pay terrible rates, you'll find the work is sometimes less then perfect
Not to mention, certain materials/practices are inferior to others.

But besides that. Its your first home.. So budget for extras.

[mr_rotary]

And because they are project builders who pay terrible rates, you'll find the work is sometimes less then perfectPoor rates is not an excuse to do a piss poor job either. Tradies still need to build to a certain standard however this is where a good supervisor is able to weed out the bad and hire reputable tradies. If you really want to see how well your house will be built look for a home under construction from that builder in your area as that will be your future supervisor/tradies working on your home. Like a certain trade on that job? Make sure you jot down the address of the home and request them (subject to tradies availability at time of construction).

[Wrexter]

I buillt with New Generation homes, a first home buyer brach of Summit homes. Very happy with the end result. They use the same materials, the same tradies as Summit, just priced better (in terms of what you get) for first home buyers, then you add what you want. They did a very good job and im a picky fucker.

[pgc]

I've only heard good things about Dale Alcock.

We built with Danmar and it was a nightmare. As mentioned previously, it was all our fault, despite having everything written on the plans. For example, they got the slab wrong to begin with. When we tackled them and asked for them to give us some money back (to account for the error) we were told we were being opportunistic. We then told them to rip up the slab.

We got our money back.

At the end of the day, if there is any doubt, query it. Don't let them tell you otherwise.

Also, strike out of the contract anything you don't agree to, before you sign it. We crossed out the section on being charged for variations. Normally a variation was $500 for a redraw of the plans. As a result of crossing it out, any and all variations were free, and we did a few.

Good luck! It's an adventure.

[Lump]

lots of 1mill plus houses around me all getting done by allcocks

[firestorm]

Try to get out of included floor coverings for sure...you'll end up with some cruddy laminate crap.

Im a timber flooring importer/machinist/wholesaler so hit me up and i can sort you out with whatever you need. Every other muppet around will rip ya.

Know someone that just finished building and went with the included floor coverings...makes the place look dull and horrible!

[mr_rotary]

Try to get out of included floor coverings for sure...you'll end up with some cruddy laminate crap. Totally agree as some of these freebies are bottom range stuff. However with some lenders and first home owners, floor coverings must be included (along with other items such as window coverings etc).

[RaGH*]

I built with Aveling and it went smoothly from start to finish. There was one hiccup with our CSO being a bit dumb and not being up to speed most of the time, but that was an inconvenience not a problem. We went with Aveling after getting shafted by Homebuyers so I wouldn't recommend them at all. Aveling had easily the best spec and best finishes for the price we were looking at and the end result for our home was top notch too. Was our first home, and we're already tempted to consider building another with Aveling even though we've only been in this place about 8-9 months.

[Risk10k]

floor coverings must be included (along with other items such as window coverings etc).



I've head this, no keys until floor coverings are done? Seems kind of Irish, that's the one job I would want to be doing myself... Mmmmmm, bamboo....

[DT95WA]

Try to get out of included floor coverings for sure...you'll end up with some cruddy laminate crap.

Im a timber flooring importer/machinist/wholesaler so hit me up and i can sort you out with whatever you need. Every other muppet around will rip ya.

Know someone that just finished building and went with the included floor coverings...makes the place look dull and horrible!

Care to message me some prices and styles you have? over this shitty fucken carpet

[Drift_R32]

Of course. I agree with you Mr_rotary

But... If u pay shit rates, the only way tradesman make money is doing as many meters in the shortest amount of time possible. And youll find the good tradesman work for company's willing to pay decent rates because their work is worth it. Leaving the lower rate work for rougher tradesman. I used to do mainly project builders in my trade, had to smash work to make a decent ammount, there wasno allowance to take your time to make sure the job was perfect. Considering rates have barely moved up in the last 10 years but price of materials have gone up prob 15-20 per cent, something has to suffer. And I can tell u know it's not Dale Alcock etc it's the sun contractors. There's no excuse for shit tradesman ATM it's not the boom Anymore but good tradesman won't work for peanuts either. So they aren't going to work for shit rates.

Supervisors I have found are only interested in getting the house done in smallest amount of time possible with least amount of back charges on maintainence. So best to keep eyes on work yourself.

[Azrian]

I built with dale allcocks and won't again. Let me just say that I supervised my own house and told the supervisor about all the fuck ups. The there was the finish. I ended up finishing things myself.

[huggy_b]

Ive built4 houses through Ross North and their associated brands. The good thing about them is they only build a certain amount of houses a year so you wont be shuffled backwards or wait an eternity or have some hack ring-in tradie do your work. Cant speak highly enough of them, may not be the cheapest but you do get what you pay for. Personally I would avoid anything built by a BGC company like the plague.

[Jumanji]

.....

[c.rusli]

I build mine with Impressions -
Reasonable price, i get most of my finishing just about my budget.

Bought the land about a year ago. and started building this year.
My slab was down on Feb and now its on final stage - fitting outs.
so im hoping to get the keys by mid of next month or so.

3 x 2 + 1 study.
Modified house plan which includes
Garage, Kitchen and Rooms. with very minimal cost they only charged me the additional materials.

400x400 Tiles on Whole house
Carpets on Rooms
Blinds
Free upgrade on Granite Kitchen Top
Free upgrade on 900 Stove and oven + range hood.
Fibre Optic ready

I also managed to score 7 Star energy rating on the house as well ;)
Solar panel,
Solar Hot water
Rain water tank
3R? Roof insulation
Wall insulation

Total cost of building is just about 205k includes pre-start

No major dramas at all, Good quality build, and Site manager is very approachable if i had questions or issues with the building.

Sales man is very helpful,
He shows me around the Pre-start office to show what we can get and what not before heading to the display house. and flexible hours to arrange meetings which mos of the time is After hours and Weekends to suit my schedule.

I compared 4-7 builders plan with price quotation and he can beat it with lower price with same / similar packages.

Awesome deals and im totally satisfied with it.

I have compared my building to others and it seems to be much better.
I Walk around to surrounding houses found 3 out of 5 houses has bad roofing timber work, where joints are miss align or not cut correctly =/
1 house seems like it has a leaning walls, bad cement contacts..

My suggestion is Shop around, and talk to people who has build with them..
GL!

Because this is the most daunting process ever
and you realize that something could be done better once the house is build.. Because i did lol! (i wished that i design my master bedroom bigger :()

[Nickevox]

Try find a private builder.

All the quotes I got to build my house were crazy, found a private builder and he was $100,000 cheaper.

[c.rusli]

NIk,
does private builder offer warranties on structures?
might want to look at this in the future if so.

[Nickevox]

Not really private sorry.

Our builder has his own business, he does everything himself so all the costs are kept to a minimum.

[Drift_R32]

Try find a private builder.

All the quotes I got to build my house were crazy, found a private builder and he was $100,000 cheaper.

Spoke to a builder I do for work for today.
Just took on 3 townhouse site

Builder quoted 200k cheaper then anyone else so naturally owners went with him

Quote was too low.. Builder Went bankrupt after bottom story was finished and pulled ticket.

Now costing owners 300k more to get houses finished as barely anyone will touch them been half finished and still put a warantee on the previous work done.

Heard this happen Afew times now with private builders

[INSINR8R]

Thanks for all the feedback. Managed to apply for the block we wanted yesterday after a few hassles trying to get in touch with the sellers. Just waiting for them to sign the offer and Dale Alcock will build. Have made sure every clause we can think of is included, will keep an eye on the building process.

Guy at DAH has been awesome thus far, has pretty much gone out of his way to help us but then again, I suppose the is his job and he'll love the commission.

As far as I know, Brendan has put his name down for a block behind ours and has someone from Scott Park coming out to see him today I believe.

Have definitely taken in to account the site inspection.

Cheers people.

[YOUR MATE]

Yeah have to say thanks again for all the feedback. I have put a block on hold, 608 sq/m. This morning I'm meeting with Scott Park Homes and tomorrow with Collier Homes. Then Thursday I will try hook up a meeting with Aveling, really liking some of their designs.

The one thing I'm taking on board is I'm not jumping into anything straight away. I'll tell them I'm meeting other builders and try get them to offer me the best they can.

Marc, I'll have to have a chat to you when you're not busy being some monopoly man tycoon motherfucker.

Will let people know how it goes with each one.

[Azrian]

Thanks for all the feedback. Managed to apply for the block we wanted yesterday after a few hassles trying to get in touch with the sellers. Just waiting for them to sign the offer and Dale Alcock will build. Have made sure every clause we can think of is included, will keep an eye on the building process.

Guy at DAH has been awesome thus far, has pretty much gone out of his way to help us but then again, I suppose the is his job and he'll love the commission.

As far as I know, Brendan has put his name down for a block behind ours and has someone from Scott Park coming out to see him today I believe.

Have definitely taken in to account the site inspection.

Cheers people.

Dale Alcock are really good with selling a house. Great customer service. Its the supervision of the house that lacks terribly. I hired a building engineer for the milestone payments to come in and inspect it. If i were you i would do the same.

[INSINR8R]

Yeah I will be. Unfortunately with every builder I've looked at, there's been excellent experiences and shit ones.

[Nickevox]

Spoke to a builder I do for work for today.
Just took on 3 townhouse site

Builder quoted 200k cheaper then anyone else so naturally owners went with him

Quote was too low.. Builder Went bankrupt after bottom story was finished and pulled ticket.

Now costing owners 300k more to get houses finished as barely anyone will touch them been half finished and still put a warantee on the previous work done.

Heard this happen Afew times now with private builders

Unlucky, my builder does 1 house at a time

[d1mitch]

^^^that doesnt cover him from under quoting and going bankrupt,

i think what drift_r32 was saying is that the bigger companies have the financial backing to always finish the job.

[YOUR MATE]

Spoke to the guy from Scott Park, he was pretty helpful in what we wanted to do. Making a bedroom larger with access to bathroom, 1m wider garage, recessed ceiling in theatre, changed layout of kitchen, double shower in ensuite, corner bath in bathroom, gas/water/power connections for outdoor kitchen, ducted air con, wider feature front door and full front rendering for 9k. Seems good. Will be calling Aveling to try catch up with them Thursday and seeing Collier tomorrow.

They are building two more places 3 houses down from the block I've chosen which he said was good as it'd speed up the process. I don't see how, but he did say it'd be 9-12 months till it's done. I think it was 207k including site costs for a 4x2 with theatre, study, activity area. Then we'd need floor coverings, window treatments and painting but we have plenty left over for that.

One thing's for sure, after growing up on a 1000sq/m block, 600 is tiny. The house is massive on the block, but there's room for a shed and some grass.

[racegtst]

full front rendering for 9k. Seems good.


Seems expensive for rendering to the front only. I have just signed with Lorimer Homes and my contract is for $10,500.00 to fully render a 2 storey house with 4 car garage. The front was included in the price.

I would go and negotiate a bit harder on the render.

[Joe]

I actually thought it was 9k for all of what he listed.. in which case, its damn cheap. You can't even buy half an air con system for a 2 storey house for that price, let alone all that!

Nothing wrong with small builders... but if you're talking about someone who does 1 house a year, best that you do your due dilligence a little better than normal.

As for individual builders, who do about 6-10 houses a year, they're going to give you great service with exceptional quality.. I wouldn't use one to build a spec-type 4x2 single story, because they're gonna be expensive, but if you're building anything beyond that, its worth getting a quote from a few... the 2 storey spec builders are hardly cheaper than going with a good individual builder.

The prices do vary wildly with the individual builders. My house quote varied by an eye-watering amount between 3 builders, with the most expensive one using his reputation to justify the increase in price, and the cheapest 2 being within a couple of percent of each other. The builder we chose for our place builds to a similar level of quality (going off the houses we walked through that he built previously), and the price was very sharp for the specification we've chosen. It does pay to look at previous builds, and if you can speak to the owners of the houses, even better, as its unbiased.

[Lump]

i think all the other shit he listed was included for 9k, not just the rendering.
thats how i read it anyway.

my 2 storey house was built by Statesman Homes, anyone know if they are any good?

[YOUR MATE]

Joe and Cranky are correct. All that I listed has driven up the price by 9 grand.

Been trying to reach Aveling homes. Told I'd get a call back as everyone is busy. 4 hours later called back and hung up on. Call them back and get told someone will get back to me later today. If they can't take a phone call I don't want them building my house.

[Joe]

That is fucking cheap for what it is.. especially with ducted air-con! Is it evap or refrig?

[Jumanji]

Handy tip, if your looking for bullshitgood quality lighting. Get junction boxes installed through out your house. then pay an electrician to come in after hand over and install what you want. That way you dont pay 50 odd % markup on all items.

[Jumanji]

^ Can save you several thousand. Jus' Sayin

[Azrian]

As Borgz said. When i built mine i have junction boxes in all ceilings and i moved all GPO's onto single brick walls.

Then once build i saved a shit load and Tom did all my lighting.

[cplagz]

Agree with what Borgz said. Ventur iD flat out told us to do our own downlighting (their std spec is 1x bayonet per room) because "they will charge us like a wounded bull"

[180SXTCY]

Yep a mate just had a house built in harrisdale, and was also told to do his own down lighting as it would save him a fair bit of money.

[Ryan1080]

Pay extra attention to the bathrooms, mainly the waterproof membrane in the shower. Most builders I was told don't give two shits about it. Request for them to install a quality membrane, and apply at least two layers of it, and don't miss a spot (especially near the floor). Hell, offer to do it yourself if too pricey in terms of labour (Bunnings sells a kit for about $130, would probably take a couple of hours to do, no brainer).

I bought a 4 year old Scott Park house, so didn't build it. After sometime, both showers started the leak to the other side of the wall, causing fungus and shit in the adjoining bedrooms. Firstly, the tiling was fucked up coz the water was pooling near the wall, but a proper membrane should prevent leakage nevertheless. The only way to fix it is to re-do the tiling farken. Smashed both bathrooms, no waterproof membrane at all! They just glued on the tiles onto the rendered surface. Previous owners instead of claiming it back through warranty just covered it up on sale.

Now I'm spending +30K redoing both bathrooms... which is fine coz they'll look a million dollars compared to the basic shit builder puts in there, and will add value, but still!

Mate built a house with another builder, after 12 months same shit happens to him. So yeah, add that to your list of things to watch out for :)

[Drift_R32]

Unlucky, my builder does 1 house at a time

So do these builders that I'm referring too
Larger companies don't under quote lol...

Yeh just be careful.. Worked on another site today in joondana that same thing happened with an owner builder
That's 3 in under a week..

[Jumanji]

Pay extra attention to the bathrooms, mainly the waterproof membrane in the shower. Most builders I was told don't give two shits about it. Request for them to install a quality membrane, and apply at least two layers of it, and don't miss a spot (especially near the floor). Hell, offer to do it yourself if too pricey in terms of labour (Bunnings sells a kit for about $130, would probably take a couple of hours to do, no brainer).

I bought a 4 year old Scott Park house, so didn't build it. After sometime, both showers started the leak to the other side of the wall, causing fungus and shit in the adjoining bedrooms. Firstly, the tiling was fucked up coz the water was pooling near the wall, but a proper membrane should prevent leakage nevertheless. The only way to fix it is to re-do the tiling farken. Smashed both bathrooms, no waterproof membrane at all! They just glued on the tiles onto the rendered surface. Previous owners instead of claiming it back through warranty just covered it up on sale.

Now I'm spending +30K redoing both bathrooms... which is fine coz they'll look a million dollars compared to the basic shit builder puts in there, and will add value, but still!

Mate built a house with another builder, after 12 months same shit happens to him. So yeah, add that to your list of things to watch out for :)

Most companies sub contract this out to A1 waterproofing (Mugg Waterproofing) can foawrd you details if you would like. I used to make them sign a disclaimer if it all turned pair shaped and they were at fault we can sue for damages ect.

[Jumanji]

Another handy tip - Dont build a house out of florentine limestone 2c bricks, they have to use half bond which in turn they use more mud, more time, more reo in beds, ect ect hence house price goes up. if they dont drop the price if this is a std selection ask why. Same goes for internal Armaclay bricks, swap them for fastwalls or verticores. any saving that isnt cosmetic and not structurally integral should be past on to you.

[Azrian]

Pay extra attention to the bathrooms, mainly the waterproof membrane in the shower. Most builders I was told don't give two shits about it. Request for them to install a quality membrane, and apply at least two layers of it, and don't miss a spot (especially near the floor). Hell, offer to do it yourself if too pricey in terms of labour (Bunnings sells a kit for about $130, would probably take a couple of hours to do, no brainer).

I bought a 4 year old Scott Park house, so didn't build it. After sometime, both showers started the leak to the other side of the wall, causing fungus and shit in the adjoining bedrooms. Firstly, the tiling was fucked up coz the water was pooling near the wall, but a proper membrane should prevent leakage nevertheless. The only way to fix it is to re-do the tiling farken. Smashed both bathrooms, no waterproof membrane at all! They just glued on the tiles onto the rendered surface. Previous owners instead of claiming it back through warranty just covered it up on sale.

Now I'm spending +30K redoing both bathrooms... which is fine coz they'll look a million dollars compared to the basic shit builder puts in there, and will add value, but still!

Mate built a house with another builder, after 12 months same shit happens to him. So yeah, add that to your list of things to watch out for :)

For this i just made it a milestone on the schedule and requested that they contact me for an inspection prior to tiling. Also the tradies always left something unlocked so i was able to inspect it daily.

[Ryan1080]

Most companies sub contract this out to A1 waterproofing (Mugg Waterproofing) can foawrd you details if you would like. I used to make them sign a disclaimer if it all turned pair shaped and they were at fault we can sue for damages ect.

Thanks. Won't be much use to me anymore anyway, I didn't build the house myself, and the warranty is probably expired on that by now anyway. The builder hasn't even kept my house plans, they dispose of them after few years, so they wouldn't even have a clue who did the work. I've already done the ensuite anyway, all expensive posh fitout so I guess it's an improvement rather than just a repair.

It's just something for the newbie to be aware of though! ;)


For this i just made it a milestone on the schedule and requested that they contact me for an inspection prior to tiling. Also the tradies always left something unlocked so i was able to inspect it daily.

That is an excellent idea!

[Jumanji]

Thanks. Won't be much use to me anymore anyway, I didn't build the house myself, and the warranty is probably expired on that by now anyway. The builder hasn't even kept my house plans, they dispose of them after few years, so they wouldn't even have a clue who did the work. I've already done the ensuite anyway, all expensive posh fitout so I guess it's an improvement rather than just a repair.

It's just something for the newbie to be aware of though! ;)



That is an excellent idea!

Oh yeah completely agree, I have heard some horror stories dont you worry about that. If anyone has any questions in relation to houses feel free to PM me ive been doing this for a while and if I dont know the answer I'll know someone that does. In relation to the quality assurance aspect thats why I started up my little side business. Being able to provide sound mind to people who have built their first house and to no fault of their own have a clue what they are signing and what the correct procedures are when it comes to things on the house you dont agree with.

[Azrian]

I used these guys for all my inspections
http://www.houspect.com.au/

Very picky which pulled up alot of errors on the builders part

[Jumanji]

I used these guys for all my inspections
http://www.houspect.com.au/

Very picky which pulled up alot of errors on the builders part

Housepect are good.

[Azrian]

IMO it was worth every cent.

I could see things that were wrong but these guys could see things that were not meeting the code.

[Azrian]

LOL that reminds me, when it was time for punch listing i hired my houspect guy to come along. The house had red poker dots everywhere. The supervisor was about to loose his shit.

[huggy_b]

I would also suggest to do upgrades to ceiling height through the living areas particularly - 31c or higher if you want, but its something thats near on impossible to do later and it makes the house seem bigger - its very noticable. And if you can get platerboard ceiling in your garage, looks 1000% better, and if you are doing an alfresco get plasterboard - cement sheets looks shithouse.

[mr_rotary]

Another handy tip - Dont build a house out of florentine limestone 2c bricks, they have to use half bond which in turn they use more mud, more time, more reo in beds, ect ect hence house price goes up. if they dont drop the price if this is a std selection ask why. Same goes for internal Armaclay bricks, swap them for fastwalls or verticores. any saving that isnt cosmetic and not structurally integral should be past on to you.Suprised about this as a standard as laying in half bond. Builders will usually lay the 2c bricks in 1/3 bond due to this reason.


And if you can get platerboard ceiling in your garage, looks 1000% better, and if you are doing an alfresco get plasterboard - cement sheets looks shithouse.I would opt for Villaboard for external areas as it's waterproof.

[Drift_R32]

I would also suggest to do upgrades to ceiling height through the living areas particularly - 31c or higher if you want, but its something thats near on impossible to do later and it makes the house seem bigger - its very noticable. And if you can get platerboard ceiling in your garage, looks 1000% better, and if you are doing an alfresco get plasterboard - cement sheets looks shithouse.

Do not get your alfresco in gyprock unless you are 100% sure roof will not leak, and if u have any type of exsposure
To the rain and wind. Scott park used to do all their alfrescos in cornice and gyprock, used to charge hard for it. have stopped as far as I was told by a supervisor due to complaints and the high amount of ones that had to be redone.

Have redone MANY that have water damage and damage from rain/wind exsposure.
Gyrock is for interior, bone dry areas..

I agree h-mould is ugly as sin..
But so is water damaged and mouldy gyrockp

[YOUR MATE]

The Scott park house has 31c to living and kitchen areas, and has a ceiling on the alfresco. I'm not sure what material it is , but I'll look into it. The place I'll be building is only 3 streets away so being able to check on it is no drama. But definitely getting an inspector on board I can justify paying for.

I know Tom, and will be talking to him about anything other than ordinary lighting I want and power outlets etc.

[esky]

Another handy tip - Dont build a house out of florentine limestone 2c bricks, they have to use half bond which in turn they use more mud, more time, more reo in beds, ect ect hence house price goes up. if they dont drop the price if this is a std selection ask why. Same goes for internal Armaclay bricks, swap them for fastwalls or verticores. any saving that isnt cosmetic and not structurally integral should be past on to you.

Florentines is the cheapest finish available, not sure how cost is an issue?

They look shit and should never be used, but not because of the cost.

[YOUR MATE]

Just spoke with the guy from Collier. All he could tell me is I'm not spending enough really and I need to make compromises. Said site works would be more than we've been told by other builders and the land provider, and that no design of theirs would meet the energy efficiency requirements for the area so it'd have to be custom. Trying to say Forrestfield is in zone 4 for that climate area, when their own website lists it as zone 1. So apparently we'd need wall insulation and a bunch of other things. If it's true, that's fucked. But as I said their own website says that the plans available would meet 6 star rating in my area. Also said things like A/C and anything like that to source elsewhere and once the house is done. Just over 200k might get us a 3x2 with theatre and tiling in the wet areas through them.

Anyone able to shed some light on this energy rating zones? I can't find shit online about it. He also mentioned having to pay carbon tax, and to pay stamp duty and then claim it back as first home buyers..

[cplagz]

Just spoke with the guy from Collier. All he could tell me is I'm not spending enough really and I need to make compromises. Said site works would be more than we've been told by other builders and the land provider, and that no design of theirs would meet the energy efficiency requirements for the area so it'd have to be custom. Trying to say Forrestfield is in zone 4 for that climate area, when their own website lists it as zone 1. So apparently we'd need wall insulation and a bunch of other things. If it's true, that's fucked. But as I said their own website says that the plans available would meet 6 star rating in my area. Also said things like A/C and anything like that to source elsewhere and once the house is done. Just over 200k might get us a 3x2 with theatre and tiling in the wet areas through them.

Anyone able to shed some light on this energy rating zones? I can't find shit online about it. He also mentioned having to pay carbon tax, and to pay stamp duty and then claim it back as first home buyers..

try www.seaus.com.au, I have a booklet about the ratings if you want to take a gander from a seminar I went to.

[Riggs]

Make it storm proof.

[mr_rotary]

No design of theirs would meet the energy efficiency requirements for the area so it'd have to be custom. Trying to say Forrestfield is in zone 4 for that climate area, when their own website lists it as zone 1. So apparently we'd need wall insulation and a bunch of other things. If it's true, that's fucked. But as I said their own website says that the plans available would meet 6 star rating in my area.

Anyone able to shed some light on this energy rating zones? I can't find shit online about it. He also mentioned having to pay carbon tax, and to pay stamp duty and then claim it back as first home buyers..
I am amazed the sales guy is selling houses (or is very poor at it). Forrestfield is classed as Zone 5 as is most of Perth metro as per NCC (National COnstruction Codes formerly called the BCA or Building Code of Australia) Part 1.1 figure 1.1.4. As for energy efficiency Part 3.12, you home is under the NatHERS climate zone of 'Perth'. What this means is you have no issues with energy ratings to make it rate other than if you do silly things like incorrect orientation, large windows etc. Sounds like he can't read a bit of paper to give you the right info.

Lastly saying to you need to pay carbon tax is a rort and should be reported. I beleive it's illegal to do this and had heard not so long ago the government was cracking down on this.

[cplagz]

I am amazed the sales guy is selling houses (or is very poor at it). Forrestfield is classed as Zone 5 as is most of Perth metro as per NCC (National COnstruction Codes formerly called the BCA or Building Code of Australia) Part 1.1 figure 1.1.4. As for energy efficiency Part 3.12, you home is under the NatHERS climate zone of 'Perth'. What this means is you have no issues with energy ratings to make it rate other than if you do silly things like incorrect orientation, large windows etc. Sounds like he can't read a bit of paper to give you the right info.

Lastly saying to you need to pay carbon tax is a rort and should be reported. I beleive it's illegal to do this and had heard not so long ago the government was cracking down on this.

No it's not, because chances are he will be slugged with it by the time he is ready to pay up. He's being open about what is going to cost you more - ask the other builders what will happen, I bet even if you sign the contract and the carbon tax comes in they will make you pay it, it will be in there somewhere.

[Ryan1080]

You'll pobably pay the carbon tax indirectly via the price of the bricks and stuff like that. But there's no way in hell they'll charge you directly and seperately for it (unless dodgy pingpingpingpings)

[HANS YOLO]

site costs...my flat ass bit of land in bayswater cost me 30k in site costs - total build was 170k = joke!

id possibly investigate your site costs externally, ie: someone with the equipment, looking for work or at least someone who knows what they are talking about

although, with the builder it just means less involvement/headaches but they will farkin charge you lots farkin!

[cplagz]

You'll pobably pay the carbon tax indirectly via the price of the bricks and stuff like that. But there's no way in hell they'll charge you directly and seperately for it (unless dodgy pingpingpingpings)

Not dodgy, it will be a part of the contract that any increases in Statutory Govt charges and Taxes will be passed on directly to the owner.

[cplagz]

site costs...my flat ass bit of land in bayswater cost me 30k in site costs - total build was 170k = joke!

id possibly investigate your site costs externally, ie: someone with the equipment, looking for work or at least someone who knows what they are talking about

although, with the builder it just means less involvement/headaches but they will farkin charge you lots farkin!

We estimate $35k/site on our developments for an "easy" job ie, no major headaches with trees/pools .etc and it's generally right, but that includes demolition AND underground power (~10-20k for a green dome to service 6 units) - are these blocks already cleared?

[Sebdullah]

just to maybe help out, had the guys from Homspect go through my house from Blueprint yesterday, all checks out fine other than little things (brick cleaning, paint runs on doors). So I can say I'm very happy with the service I have gotten thus far from them.

[HANS YOLO]

We estimate $35k/site on our developments for an "easy" job ie, no major headaches with trees/pools .etc and it's generally right, but that includes demolition AND underground power (~10-20k for a green dome to service 6 units) - are these blocks already cleared?

yeah mate...block was cleared with no pool and the green dome was already in place...i got raped! they did it i think just to make some money on my build, everything else seemed such a great price - retaining wall on flat bit of land...still don't understand that one but they claimed my plans wouldn't get through shire without them in it (built with Ventura ID)

[cplagz]

yeah mate...block was cleared with no pool and the green dome was already in place...i got raped! they did it i think just to make some money on my build, everything else seemed such a great price - retaining wall on flat bit of land...still don't understand that one but they claimed my plans wouldn't get through shire without them in it (built with Ventura ID)

I cant specifically comment but that does seem excessively high unless you had a large power run or something (100m+) then it starts to add up quickly. YGPM though.

[YOUR MATE]

These blocks are already clear, flat, power domes etc. Only thing is being Forrestfield there is clay, and even thought they've removed some and filled in with sand, it's not all of it. I called the building commision after finding the link on the Kalamunda Shire website and they said it's nothing to worry about. Every house goes up individually and they hadn't heard of it being any harder to get compliance here than anywhere else in Perth.
Here is the link from the Collier site. http://www.collierhomes.com.au/index.php/download_file/view/662/219/
It even lists Forrestfield as in the main area, not Bickley, so he might just be confused I'll give him that. But either way he didn't even show us a single layout, just mentioned getting extra work done once they're gone and that we might need to spend more, which is pretty piss weak.

Meeting with the girl from Aveling in the morning.

[KPWISHN]

Full site prep to finished sand pad cost me about $1500 on what would be a similar block. A days work for a mate with a machine and most of the cost was tip fees. Then the appropriate engineer or whatever does a peno test for a couple of hundred bucks and you are good to start building.

These big building companies can go and eat a dick quoting figures above $10K for a stocko clean up and compact on a subdivision lot.

Also make sure you fully understand how the house will be handed over and what you will still need to spend. Generally a good $50K needs spending on top of what you get for the quoted price before it is proper finished.

[d1mitch]

You'll pobably pay the carbon tax indirectly via the price of the bricks and stuff like that. But there's no way in hell they'll charge you directly and seperately for it (unless dodgy pingpingpingpings)

well this is what they were predicting with the carbon tax (that the end consumer will pay for it indirectly) so collier is just cutting the bullshit and charging the client the full carbon tax directly. lol

carbon tax for companies = handballed carbon tax for consumers

[JBAE]

USE BRICKS!

[cplagz]

Clay soils can cause some issues, I don't know all of it in depth but I would think being that the blocks are being sold with services already run it should be ready to lay a slab.

[YOUR MATE]

So the chick I was talking to at Aveling said because the block ins't a perfect square she can't help me, will have to get a draftsman etc. Fuck that. Rung Dale Alcock yesterday morning and had the rep here by 11. He seemed great, said the whole energy thing they will pass and it's not an issue. They insulate walls etc already. They can build us a 3x2 variation of one of their homes as the 4x2 is too long for the block. So it'd be 3x2 with theatre, study and activity area that my brother can call a study. It won't have higher ceilings/feature ceilings, wider garage and a few other thigns the Scott Park one would, but it comes with air con, tiling and carpets, painting and window treatments. It is a turn key house for $218k + $20k site costs. I mentioned that all other builders are quoting less, as is the developer of the estate, for the site works but they said "it'll cost what it'll cost, and if it's less then great".

It's 30 grand more for a smaller house, but it's ready to move in. And we can save 5k by painting it ourselves, which we could put into raised ceilings in living areas. Choosing between the two is where we're at right now.

[esky]

lol.

I'm getting a car built by holden, i'll save a few bucks if i paint it myself. Great idea.

[Azrian]

5000 for painting the house is great. I didnt have my house painted when i built and it cost me $3000 to paint. Next time i would get them to do it for the hassle.

[c.rusli]

Must get a high ceiling, it really makes a small house look bigger.

[YOUR MATE]

lol.

I'm getting a car built by holden, i'll save a few bucks if i paint it myself. Great idea.

Neighbour/friend is a painter and will paint it for substantially less.

[esky]

That's different to "And we can save 5k by painting it ourselves" my chunky friend.

[180SXTCY]

Clay soils can cause some issues, I don't know all of it in depth but I would think being that the blocks are being sold with services already run it should be ready to lay a slab.

I think the problem with clay is that it expands and contracts which causes cracking and it also has very poor water absorbtion characteristics... so you'd end up with puddles everywhere etc.

[Ryan1080]

In regards to painting, I suggest you wait a while before you do that.

All new walls and plaster start getting small cracks within the first 12 months or so, as everything gets settled properly, keep in mind there is hundreds of kilos of roof above sitting on those walls, they will move and adjust themselves over time. And while that happens, obviously plaster and bricks aren't flexible, they crack, and it's visible.

Save your cash/effort and do it after 12 months man. Otherwise it will start looking like shit, and you'd have to re-do it. What's the point?

Ceilings are ok to paint btw.

Oh, and when you compare quotes, there are a lot of painters that go off and use a spray gun, rather than a roller. The result looks shit in comparison to a decent roller job. Keep that in mind too.

I used to paint houses for a couple of years

[mr_rotary]

So the chick I was talking to at Aveling said because the block ins't a perfect square she can't help me, will have to get a draftsman etc.Interested to see this block. If slightly out of sqaure it should not be an issue. As for getting a designer/draftee involved, was there a cost associated with that? A 3x2 can re-name study or activity to 'bed 4' and enclose it. If study near bedrooms with a door, call it 'Study/Bed 4'.

As discussed, paint after 12 months especially if a clay site. The house needs to settle and you WILL get fine cracks along your walls and floor. Part of settling and within tolerences as set out by the engineer.

As for air con, tiling and carpets, painting and window treatments, be prepared they are very basic and bottom spec. As long as you are happy with that.

[R3N]

In regards to painting, I suggest you wait a while before you do that.

All new walls and plaster start getting small cracks within the first 12 months or so, as everything gets settled properly, keep in mind there is hundreds of kilos of roof above sitting on those walls, they will move and adjust themselves over time. And while that happens, obviously plaster and bricks aren't flexible, they crack, and it's visible.

Save your cash/effort and do it after 12 months man. Otherwise it will start looking like shit, and you'd have to re-do it. What's the point?

Ceilings are ok to paint btw.

Oh, and when you compare quotes, there are a lot of painters that go off and use a spray gun, rather than a roller. The result looks shit in comparison to a decent roller job. Keep that in mind too.

I used to paint houses for a couple of years

Completely off topic, but your post looks like a Yahoo Answers answer

[Lasoya]

Im currently going through the building process atm with Redink Homes. Building in baldivis, pre-start meeting next week

[MadDocker]

Must get a high ceiling, it really makes a small house look bigger.

Biggest regret I have with my house is not getting high ceilings in the living area. You cant exactly go back and do it later either but you can wait a while for paint. Get the high ceilings if it's a toss up between them and paint without a doubt or you will regret your decision.

I painted my own house over a couple of weekends. It's a shit job to do but isn't hard and saves heaps of money. No brainer for me really because I'm not baller enough to throw away a few thousand $$ on something that I can do myself easily.

[INSINR8R]

Interested to see this block. If slightly out of sqaure it should not be an issue. As for getting a designer/draftee involved, was there a cost associated with that? A 3x2 can re-name study or activity to 'bed 4' and enclose it. If study near bedrooms with a door, call it 'Study/Bed 4'.

As discussed, paint after 12 months especially if a clay site. The house needs to settle and you WILL get fine cracks along your walls and floor. Part of settling and within tolerences as set out by the engineer.

As for air con, tiling and carpets, painting and window treatments, be prepared they are very basic and bottom spec. As long as you are happy with that.

Its a square block that one back corner is basically a dog ear.

[Ryan1080]

Completely off topic, but your post looks like a Yahoo Answers answer

What's that mean?

I just wrote all this myself, didn't rip it off any website...

[180SXTCY]

Im currently going through the building process atm with Redink Homes. Building in baldivis, pre-start meeting next week

Let me know what they're like to deal with, as I'm waiting on a call back from them too to see what they can offer me.

[Lasoya]

Im building 4x2 with activity and study, house comes with 31c ceilings to living area, 900mm appliances, rangehood, stone benchtops, ducted reverse cycle air con, solar hot water etc for 191k, total house size is 285m2, i also am raising ceiling in garage 3c higher :)

[R3N]

What's that mean?

I just wrote all this myself, didn't rip it off any website...

I meant the format, usually at the bottom of the Yahoo Answers response, the poster states qualification/source. LOL just ignore.

/OT

[180SXTCY]

quack has been googling to much "how to a finger a girl"

[Jumanji]

Im currently going through the building process atm with Redink Homes. Building in baldivis, pre-start meeting next week


LOL fuck I feel sorry for you. They outsource all work to malaysia, all of the drafting and scheduling will be fucked theyre currently waiting a month after slab down to load it, which is shocking to say the least, if anything request Mark Schrandt to be your supervisor specifically because hes a champ and is a registered builder the other half wit supers I wouldnt wast my time with. Plus the manager hasnt got a fucking clue what hes doing. I worked there for 4 years, glad I got out of that train wreck.

[DRKWRX]

^^^ lol sounds like most the supervisors I meet.

[heavyduty1340]

Fuck I feel for ya

I am currentky trying to pick a builder to build us a new home down in Bussleotn - half the sales people are bored rich house wives who think the can sell a house, but know fuck all about designing them etc.

The rest just want to fucken rip me off.

Weve told them what we want, and what out house budget is, but the dumb pricks continually come back with prices 50k to 100k over what we tell them :mad:

We get ripped an extra 30k or more down here for the same thing you get in the metro area!!

Im over it and wish I hadnt decided to move, but I want the good house/alfresco and big shed set-up this time

[ovaxitd]

LOL fuck I feel sorry for you. They outsource all work to malaysia, all of the drafting and scheduling will be fucked theyre currently waiting a month after slab down to load it, which is shocking to say the least, if anything request Mark Schrandt to be your supervisor specifically because hes a champ and is a registered builder the other half wit supers I wouldnt wast my time with. Plus the manager hasnt got a fucking clue what hes doing. I worked there for 4 years, glad I got out of that train wreck.

the ppl next door to us on rural property have gone with redink 4x2 and are very impressed, they have only taken 6 months and almost at lock up, all looking smick and no dramas at all...

personally i built with homebuyers in 2005 and never had a drama and that was when they were smashing houses up... minor things like bricks, power point in wrong position etc door handles wrong .. only minor and people are human.

what most of you need to remember alot of these builders use contract brickie teams who work for them and if you speak with them some do more than one builders work.... its not the company personel who build your house... the chosen company only fails due to the choice of builder team they use and the quality of the site supervisor.

i am going to be going through another house build soonish.. considering owner builder... people on other side of me have just done this saved $$ and looks hollywood.. but they have also had their fare share of retards and set backs and its taken 12 mths to build (they paid everything cash)

what i have been looking at is there is PLENTY of competition and atm just like cars it is a BUYERS market... keep shopping till your happy as it is hard to change your mind afterwards....the old do it once do it right chestnut... what some people dont remember is Haggle with the builders... you dont need to pay the asking price... they are keen for sale and want your business so they will eb willing to work for it.

good luck to all of you

[mr_rotary]

Fuck I feel for ya

I am currentky trying to pick a builder to build us a new home down in Bussleotn - half the sales people are bored rich house wives who think the can sell a house, but know fuck all about designing them etc.

The rest just want to fucken rip me off.

Weve told them what we want, and what out house budget is, but the dumb pricks continually come back with prices 50k to 100k over what we tell them :mad:

We get ripped an extra 30k or more down here for the same thing you get in the metro area!!

Im over it and wish I hadnt decided to move, but I want the good house/alfresco and big shed set-up this timeIf your interested, shoot me a PM and I can help you out with the correct sales person to deal with down there.

[YOUR MATE]

Seeing as it's end of financial year and the fact the worst I can be told is no, I've decided to go lowballing. I've got a second meeting with both Scott Park Homes and Dale Alcock's tomorrow and Wednesday, and am catching up with Gemmil homes tomorrow arvo. They all know that they're not the only builders I'm talking to so hoping they'll offer me some extra shit. Like I said, the worst they'll say is no and it's not like I cant afford to pay the asking price, but I could end up saving a bit. Same with the block, I'm going to offer 10k less than asking price hoping they'll just take it.

Starting the whole process with finance options now. Been speaking to both my bank and a friend who's a broker and doing another mates finance. Any one here into that sort of thing? I think it was Bankwest who I've been told to avoid, the rest are prett much on par with each other.

[Drift_R32]

Off topic but heard some pretty funny story's about the redink top dogs having pig ons with there receptionist etc

Dunno if they are true..
One thing that is true is they are fucking crooks.
Would never work for them ever again...

[INSINR8R]

That's how Scott Park lost his original company wasn't it? Caught boning his receptionist?

[ovaxitd]

the same thing with cars at end of year/ tax time deals.. its only counted once settled. so for your block it would need to be fast finance :p but worth a crack... better in your pocket than theirs.

im looking atm now at dale alcock house design....damn you for the ideas...

[KPWISHN]

Regardless what time of year it is, Lowball away. They need work now more than ever. Don't be shy either. Cane them.

[H1GHROLLR]

Building with celebrations in baldivis at the moment , prices seem fair service is good , im very happy :) even with 42k worth of variations , thanks to the missis , but she does the good blow suck so game on fair play

[Jumanji]

That's how Scott Park lost his original company wasn't it? Caught boning his receptionist?

Yep, she went from receptionist on sub 60k a year C/L officer on sub 90k a year in 3 months. And got an appartment and car. LOL

[INSINR8R]

Living the dream.

[TJ]

id considering copping one for 90k and a house and car

[Bomber]

id considering copping one for 90k and a house and car
...ziiiiiiiiiip....

[YOUR MATE]

Well so far it's been nothing but a fuck around trying to secure this block. Lowball offer was knocked back, so I upped it to the asking price. That was over a week ago. Since then no contact with the estate agent selling the land at all. Not returning calls or emails, still only having dealt with the guys secretary. Ended up going to the head office for Ray White, the parent company, who said they'd be in contact within 24 hours. Last night I get a call from the CEO of Ray White, tells me he has sorted it out. Then the property bitch calls me from work that night saying it's mine and all good. Some might think its gone a bit far but the block was re listed yesterday at a higher price, after I had an offer on it for the asking price. I wasn't going to take that shit, especially when the bitch can't even answer a phone.

So at this stage we've picked and signed up with Gemmil homes. 4x2, theatre, study. second bedroom is like a guest suite, with walk in robes and semi en suite, larger shower etc. 31c ceilings to living, dining and kitchen. Recessed feature ceiling in theatre. Larger main entry with double front doors, 1m wider garage and roller door/driveway, upgraded hot water and air con, extra robes in the other bedrooms. Probably things I've missed, but I managed to get a fair few changes and upgrades nothing. Not as cheap as I'd of liked but wwanted to spend under 500k and we've allocated a fair bit for extras/incidentals that come up and added quite a bit extra to upgrade flooring and window treatments.

Still stashing money away towards it all. Need to stop watching cribs. I want so much shit it isn't even funny.

[d1mitch]

Well so far it's been nothing but a fuck around trying to secure this block. Lowball offer was knocked back, so I upped it to the asking price. That was over a week ago. Since then no contact with the estate agent selling the land at all. Not returning calls or emails, still only having dealt with the guys secretary. Ended up going to the head office for Ray White, the parent company, who said they'd be in contact within 24 hours. Last night I get a call from the CEO of Ray White, tells me he has sorted it out. Then the property bitch calls me from work that night saying it's mine and all good. Some might think its gone a bit far but the block was re listed yesterday at a higher price, after I had an offer on it for the asking price. I wasn't going to take that shit, especially when the bitch can't even answer a phone.

what???? so she said its yours then they have relisted it? if so i would be going fucking mad over that shit. call the CEO back, he wont appreciate people making him looking like a fucking idiot

[YOUR MATE]

Knocked back lowball offer, fair enough. In the call where she told me that I said offer asking price and I'll take it. Didn't hear from her for a week. Adrian (INSINR8R on here) who had an ofer at asking price for the block he wanted 2 weeks ago also hadn't heard from her. Then listing appear on net at higher prices. She still won't answer calls, so went to head office who roped CEO in. Seems it worked as after business hours an hour after he calls me she rings me to say it's all good.

[cplagz]

So did you have an o&a drawn up signed and submitted? Until the vendor officially accepts the offer in writing don't ever believe the agent.

[YOUR MATE]

Yeah we went in and signed the papers etc subject to finance. Was told by the agent if they didn't accept the lower offer we wouldnt need to sign another if we raised it, so I never thought it'd get re-listed. Supposedly she hasn't been at work all week and that's why she hadn't gotten back to us. if that were the case I don't know how it ended back up on the net. I don't believe a thing she says, but having her bosses bosses boss telling me he'll sort her out makes me feel a bit better.

[31-EVO]

Non responsibility company.

It is a complete pain in the ring trying to chase everything up when you're building, I have no idea what land is worth in the metro areas, but I take my hat off to you for following it through, I would of thrown my arms up in the air and said 'too hard'. Thats why I gave up trying to build and settled for buying, lazy pingpingpingping

[Poktrokt]

All i will say about building your first home is make sure you use a building inspector at every stage of the build... budget about $2k for this as it will cover pretty much every inspection at each stage of the build...

[QUOTE=cplagz;1012263]So did you have an o&a drawn up signed and submitted? Until the vendor officially accepts the offer in writing don't ever believe the agent.

as others have said, find a good reputable Building Inspector to do every stage, as a first home buyer your judgement will be clouded with excitement etc and you will find yourself settling on issues you will later regret.
every builder has its good and bad but agreed that its all about the Supervisor. dont let the pretty girl who helps pick colours etc fool you haha
I'm a bad luck magnet, if it can go wrong it will!!! haha I had issues with my block in Wattle Grove where we threatened legal action against Ross North (we got out of the deal thankfully) and bought another block in WG, be sure you understand whats included in the Block too like fencing and when its to be errected, this can cause you grief down the track.
My Tips:
- be mindful of the soak wells, not all builders include this and you will then need to do yourself before house can eb completed and can put you back a fair amount.
- Fencing around the property included with block, this can be a drama later forking out for all the fence then hitting up the neighbours for half.
- being able to contact your Supervisor, not all builders allow this and its essential! trust me
- dont stretch yourself too much and go for the top quality items for a first home, this is up to you but as its not your last house and you will prob upgrade sooner than later its a good idea not to over capitalise
- design your house to be enviro friendly (living areas facing the right way) so as to minimise the use of your aircon etc
- be cautious of what advice you take from people as this is your money at the end of the day and can do with what you want. you will find a LOT of people (family etc) will all have 50 opinions haha
- get parts of your design quoted by 3rd parties like your tiling etc, the builder may only come in a tiny bit more expensive but the hassel you will save is enormous! then again a trady may come in a LOT cheaper, this applies to paving, carpets etc (most of your everyday builders wont allow you to source much of your own material and labour
- dont be afraid to negotiate!!!
- dont assume soemthing is too expensive, the builder may do it for less as they have higher profit in somethign else (ie; you may get high cielings throughout for bugger all)
- send your design to other ppl who have built for some tips, like where is a good place to have your outdoor taps, putting your gas outlet in the alfresco for the BBQ and heater instead of inside (if you do reverse cycle), getting the water plumbed for the fridge etc etc
- make sure your on top of everything and manage them managing your project, the more you are involved (helpful involvement not hindering) the more likely you will eb prepared for issues.

all in all each builder is different and its hard to say use or dont use X builder for a reason that is due to staff as they change frequently.

[cplagz]

Yeah we went in and signed the papers etc subject to finance. Was told by the agent if they didn't accept the lower offer we wouldnt need to sign another if we raised it, so I never thought it'd get re-listed. Supposedly she hasn't been at work all week and that's why she hadn't gotten back to us. if that were the case I don't know how it ended back up on the net. I don't believe a thing she says, but having her bosses bosses boss telling me he'll sort her out makes me feel a bit better.

All you have to do is amend the original O&A to new dollar amount and initial it. It probably got relisted by one of the admin staff and not the agent

[cplagz]

Oh yeah.... start getting BA20 forms signed haha

[mr_rotary]

- be mindful of the soak wells, not all builders include this and you will then need to do yourself before house can eb completed and can put you back a fair amount.
The builder is responsible for all building licence conditions which includes stormwater drainage and soakwells. Simply putting 'by owner' does not make the builder exempt.

As outlined by the BRB:
http://www.buildingcommission.wa.gov.au/docs/newsletters-brb-and-prb/brb_newsletter_dec_101201.pdf

Also true about getting family (and friends) involved as it can often open a can of worms with 50 different (and sometimes incorrect) opinions. Forums can be even worse.....

[Jumanji]

The builder is responsible for all building licence conditions which includes stormwater drainage and soakwells. Simply putting 'by owner' does not make the builder exempt.

As outlined by the BRB:
http://www.buildingcommission.wa.gov.au/docs/newsletters-brb-and-prb/brb_newsletter_dec_101201.pdf

Also true about getting family (and friends) involved as it can often open a can of worms with 50 different (and sometimes incorrect) opinions. Forums can be even worse.....

Correct however, this is NOT a standard cost, it isnt included in the clients PPA at the begining and this is pretty standard accross the industry...

[SimonR32]

Someone in the know about the building industry feeling kind and keen to lend me 5 min of their time to answer a few quick questions about building defects?

I'm in a 3 year old home that has a few issues with cornice cracks, leaking common wall to shower and external paint on rendering fading/cracking...

Can you please send me a PM and I'll write back with some questions. Cheers

[mr_rotary]

Correct however, this is NOT a standard cost, it isnt included in the clients PPA at the begining and this is pretty standard accross the industry...Should still be shown as a PS allowance by either sales person or estimating and is deceitful. Hence why clients get a little upset when earthwork amounts increase when they get their contract if not advised.

[Jumanji]

Should still be shown as a PS allowance by either sales person or estimating and is deceitful. Hence why clients get a little upset when earthwork amounts increase when they get their contract if not advised.

Which is 90% of the time in the project Builders market. And its "Provisional" so it can change from $10 to $10,000.00 most builders dont include stormwater from standard. IMHO do it yourself for the sake of 3 soakwells and some pipe and a few holes, screw paying sub 4k for it, when you can bang it out in a weekend.

[cplagz]

Which is 90% of the time in the project Builders market. And its "Provisional" so it can change from $10 to $10,000.00 most builders dont include stormwater from standard. IMHO do it yourself for the sake of 3 soakwells and some pipe and a few holes, screw paying sub 4k for it, when you can bang it out in a weekend.

Yeah and good luck getting a building permit. The engineers drawings have to show the ground fall .etc for correct drainage.

[Jumanji]

Yeah and good luck getting a building permit. The engineers drawings have to show the ground fall .etc for correct drainage.

No structural change, under $5,000.00 of works to the house so does not have to be put through shire. And if it is to be done by owner, the builder HAS to supply you with the working drawings and give you ample time to complete.

[Lasoya]

Redink homes tried slugging me 3.1k for soakwells haha, deselected that straight up, will dig all soakwells and put them in myself after i move in. They just have to be placed to council restrictions and requirements

[Jumanji]

Redink homes tried slugging me 3.1k for soakwells haha, deselected that straight up, will dig all soakwells and put them in myself after i move in. They just have to be placed to council restrictions and requirements

Sometimes they can make you put them in when the do pre-lays so be careful.

[INSINR8R]

Well so far it's been nothing but a fuck around trying to secure this block. Lowball offer was knocked back, so I upped it to the asking price. That was over a week ago. Since then no contact with the estate agent selling the land at all. Not returning calls or emails, still only having dealt with the guys secretary. Ended up going to the head office for Ray White, the parent company, who said they'd be in contact within 24 hours. Last night I get a call from the CEO of Ray White, tells me he has sorted it out. Then the property bitch calls me from work that night saying it's mine and all good. Some might think its gone a bit far but the block was re listed yesterday at a higher price, after I had an offer on it for the asking price. I wasn't going to take that shit, especially when the bitch can't even answer a phone.

So at this stage we've picked and signed up with Gemmil homes. 4x2, theatre, study. second bedroom is like a guest suite, with walk in robes and semi en suite, larger shower etc. 31c ceilings to living, dining and kitchen. Recessed feature ceiling in theatre. Larger main entry with double front doors, 1m wider garage and roller door/driveway, upgraded hot water and air con, extra robes in the other bedrooms. Probably things I've missed, but I managed to get a fair few changes and upgrades nothing. Not as cheap as I'd of liked but wwanted to spend under 500k and we've allocated a fair bit for extras/incidentals that come up and added quite a bit extra to upgrade flooring and window treatments.

Still stashing money away towards it all. Need to stop watching cribs. I want so much shit it isn't even funny.


Knocked back lowball offer, fair enough. In the call where she told me that I said offer asking price and I'll take it. Didn't hear from her for a week. Adrian (INSINR8R on here) who had an ofer at asking price for the block he wanted 2 weeks ago also hadn't heard from her. Then listing appear on net at higher prices. She still won't answer calls, so went to head office who roped CEO in. Seems it worked as after business hours an hour after he calls me she rings me to say it's all good.

x2. Brendan did all the work, we get a call from her too, now the block is officially ours.

So much frustration, but now it's all happening. Still saving also.

Ours is being built by Dale Alcock Homes, The Hudson on their website with minor changes. Will be using Houspect to watch over the build.

[mr_rotary]

Which is 90% of the time in the project Builders market. And its "Provisional" so it can change from $10 to $10,000.00 most builders dont include stormwater from standard. IMHO do it yourself for the sake of 3 soakwells and some pipe and a few holes, screw paying sub 4k for it, when you can bang it out in a weekend.The builder is unable to charge you more than 5% over the PS allowance. If it's more, then the client is under no obligation to proceed. Getting deep here but it's all written in the act somewhere and a while since I read it as it's now not part of my duties.

[Joe]

Not sure what soakwells your builders are quoting you on for that sort of money, but I'd hope they're concrete for the price.... depending on the size, you'll need a fuckin crane to lift the bastards.

The 1200 x 1200 concrete ones on my build weigh close to 1000kg each with the lids on... and including digging the holes, craning them in, and connecting them up, we're talking about $2,500 for 2 of them. Didn't think it was that pricey considering the size and weight!

[YOUR MATE]

"Stormwater disposal to residence piped to concrete soakwells" $4500.

[INSINR8R]

Yeah, ours is the same. It's a Shire of Kalamunda requirement they are built to have interconnecting soak wells.

[YOUR MATE]

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d28/Nthn_suss/be09a890.jpg

Digging those yourself? Fuck that.

[GA70TT]

Fuck me that's a big bitch

Gosnells and busselton are ones I find that have issues with storm water by owner. Mostly because if the plans say "by owner" they think it won't get done, which is a fair point.

Borgz is on the ball, trust what he says :p

[Jumanji]

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d28/Nthn_suss/be09a890.jpg

Digging those yourself? Fuck that.

yes if you put two of those big fat bastards in thats true, however you can substitute for smaller ones and more of them. Comes down on a ratio.

[R3N]

Somewhat related, does anyone know of any good building inspectors to conduct a final inspection for defects on a new place? And how much it would cost roughly? Just want to make sure i get an independent take on what's considered acceptable and what isn't

[Sebdullah]

http://www.houspect.com.au/

cost me about $700 for my place

[Lasoya]

http://www.houspect.com.au/

cost me about $700 for my place
Whas that a pre-built house? they quoted me well over 2k for building inspections, though it is worth it

[Sebdullah]

it was after building was completed

[Joe]

Fellow AL'ers,

How did you guys go with your local council in relation to your plans?

Our council took 58 days to respond (the law allows 60 days) to our initial planning application, and we had 2 weeks to reply to anything they raised or knocked back (of which they found 2 very frivolous aspects of our plan they weren't happy with).

So we responded to this, and its now taken another 2 weeks for them to get back to us on that.

Basically, they've not indicated anything in particular, except that the plans now have to go to Community Consultation and advertising for 2 weeks.. and they can still reject our response to the issues raised, whether this consultation process is successful or not, if they wish, as they hold discretionary power over any public comments made.

Is this normal, or is our council being a dick?

I'm looking forward to getting our building plans approved under the new laws (should only take 2 weeks max, and the council hasn't got a say in the matter as I'll be using an independent contractor to sign off and issue a cert).. but the planning side is giving me the shits.

[mr_rotary]

Is this normal, or is our council being a dick?Welcome to dealing with shires! Then you wonder why clients get shitty with the builders.

[cplagz]

Fellow AL'ers,

How did you guys go with your local council in relation to your plans?

Our council took 58 days to respond (the law allows 60 days) to our initial planning application, and we had 2 weeks to reply to anything they raised or knocked back (of which they found 2 very frivolous aspects of our plan they weren't happy with).

So we responded to this, and its now taken another 2 weeks for them to get back to us on that.

Basically, they've not indicated anything in particular, except that the plans now have to go to Community Consultation and advertising for 2 weeks.. and they can still reject our response to the issues raised, whether this consultation process is successful or not, if they wish, as they hold discretionary power over any public comments made.

Is this normal, or is our council being a dick?

I'm looking forward to getting our building plans approved under the new laws (should only take 2 weeks max, and the council hasn't got a say in the matter as I'll be using an independent contractor to sign off and issue a cert).. but the planning side is giving me the shits.

It's Town of Vincent, I told you it was going to be a fight. They are notoriously bad.

As for the Building Permit, you aren't thinking of DAPs are you?

[Sebdullah]

just the way councils are Joe, sometimes it's quick & simple other times it can be a bastard to get anything to get cleared by them

[Joe]

It's Town of Vincent, I told you it was going to be a fight. They are notoriously bad.

As for the Building Permit, you aren't thinking of DAPs are you?

I'm going to get a Certificate of Design Compliance from a private certifier (a mate of mine I went to school with).. the council then has to issue a building license on that certificate, no questions asked.

I knew councils were bad, but it just seems that all around me, heaps of people are getting their shit through very easily. Not sure if its because I ruffled the councils feathers on other issues or not, but yeah, its annoying nevertheless.

[SimonR32]

They didn't like the concrete Lions?

[waxdass]

Fellow AL'ers,

How did you guys go with your local council in relation to your plans?

Our council took 58 days to respond (the law allows 60 days) to our initial planning application, and we had 2 weeks to reply to anything they raised or knocked back (of which they found 2 very frivolous aspects of our plan they weren't happy with).

So we responded to this, and its now taken another 2 weeks for them to get back to us on that.

Basically, they've not indicated anything in particular, except that the plans now have to go to Community Consultation and advertising for 2 weeks.. and they can still reject our response to the issues raised, whether this consultation process is successful or not, if they wish, as they hold discretionary power over any public comments made.

Is this normal, or is our council being a dick?

I'm looking forward to getting our building plans approved under the new laws (should only take 2 weeks max, and the council hasn't got a say in the matter as I'll be using an independent contractor to sign off and issue a cert).. but the planning side is giving me the shits.

I went to my local government member and complained a shitload at the time city of wanneroo was taking to process my house plans. Plans got approved the following week.

[cplagz]

I'm going to get a Certificate of Design Compliance from a private certifier (a mate of mine I went to school with).. the council then has to issue a building license on that certificate, no questions asked.

I knew councils were bad, but it just seems that all around me, heaps of people are getting their shit through very easily. Not sure if its because I ruffled the councils feathers on other issues or not, but yeah, its annoying nevertheless.

Yes but the time frame to issue the Building Permit itself will remain the same. Once you have approved plans I would just keep ringing every week to see if the building permit has progressed, end of the day they can fuck you around a lot more if they feel like it.

[Sebdullah]

must be lots of germans on that council

[Joe]

Yes but the time frame to issue the Building Permit itself will remain the same. Once you have approved plans I would just keep ringing every week to see if the building permit has progressed, end of the day they can fuck you around a lot more if they feel like it.

10 days if you present a certificate to them, 28 days if they're doing the approval for you.

[Aristoman]

must be lots of germans on that council

I take offense to that, you ozzy kent :p

Please elaborate in anycase ?

[Jumanji]

I'm going to get a Certificate of Design Compliance from a private certifier (a mate of mine I went to school with).. the council then has to issue a building license on that certificate, no questions asked.

I knew councils were bad, but it just seems that all around me, heaps of people are getting their shit through very easily. Not sure if its because I ruffled the councils feathers on other issues or not, but yeah, its annoying nevertheless.


Councils are bad in particular at the moment because in April they had a "Review" of how they pass Building Licenses and for that month got out only a 1/5 of the average for that month. So there was a massive back log to say the least. Beaurocratic nightmare to say the least.

[regi]

Joe!

Statutory timeframes for planning approvals are 60 days (no consultation required) or 90 days (requires consultation).
Although this sounds as if its in your favour if they go over the 60 days, its not, because it's automatically deemed refused. Very bad form on their part.

Inner city councils tend to be useless and what you are experiencing is not uncommon.

It shouldn't have taken them that long to complete an assessment, but it sounds as though they have identified some variations to the R-Codes (or maybe some other policy if they have one) which require consultation with affected neighbours.

Down my way we would let you know there are variations, give you the opportunity to change the plans and if you are set on the design - advertise it for 14 days and see if there are any objections from affected neighbours. If there aren't objections they should be able to approve it (most councils can do this under officer delegation, others have to be approved at council meeting). If there are objections then they can either be dismissed, or if they are valid, they can refuse or request further changes to the plans.

If they are advertising the variations, they obviously know what they are and should be able to tell you. You will get a letter saying they are advertising it in accordance with the R-Codes (and maybe a specific housing policy if there is one).

Let me know where the application is and I'll see if I know anyone there.

xoxo

[regi]

also borgs, heaps of council building surveyors have bailed from Councils because under the new Building Act, they can get way more cash with private certications

[Sebdullah]

I take offense to that, you ozzy kent :p

Please elaborate in anycase ?

Dude I'm german (so it's ok), Joe=jew
do the maths

[Jumanji]

also borgs, heaps of council building surveyors have bailed from Councils because under the new Building Act, they can get way more cash with private certications

Yes I heard that through the grapevine we were having a discussion about that at work the other day, do you work for a council?

[regi]

yeah, the 'ol swingin pig

[Jumanji]

hahahaha nice, Currently working for Amano Homes as the Senior Scheduler / Estimator there. We mainly do Mansions and big Unit Developments. Good work, nothings the same so keeps me interested hahahah. So glad I got out of the Project Builder industry :D

[Aristoman]

Dude I'm german (so it's ok), Joe=jew
do the maths

Italian Jew :p

All good, krauts unite !

[RELEASE]

Apologies for the thread hijack, peoples thoughts and opinions on Gemmil & New Choice?

[Joe]

Joe!

Statutory timeframes for planning approvals are 60 days (no consultation required) or 90 days (requires consultation).
Although this sounds as if its in your favour if they go over the 60 days, its not, because it's automatically deemed refused. Very bad form on their part.

Inner city councils tend to be useless and what you are experiencing is not uncommon.

It shouldn't have taken them that long to complete an assessment, but it sounds as though they have identified some variations to the R-Codes (or maybe some other policy if they have one) which makes it even more bff

Down my way we would let you know there are variations, give you the opportunity to change the plans and if you are set on the design - advertise it for 14 days and see if there are any objections from affected neighbours. If there aren't objections they should be able to approve it (most councils can do this under officer delegation, others have to be approved at council meeting). If there are objections then they can either be dismissed, or if they are valid, they can refuse or request further changes to the plans.

If they are advertising the variations, they obviously know what they are and should be able to tell you. You will get a letter saying they are advertising it in accordance with the R-Codes (and maybe a specific housing policy if there is one).

Let me know where the application is and I'll see if I know anyone there.

xoxo

Thanks for that mate.. the plan has gone for advertising now, as some parts of it lie outside the Council's design guidelines (NOT the R-Codes).

The problem is, their design guidelines basically suit a very simple design, upper level smaller than the lower level, 45 degree pitched roof, garage set to the side of the house... simply not an option in this suburb (given the frontages range from 9-13m for the most part), which makes it even more baffling.

They're not saying that its strictly enforced, it is flexible at their discretion, but thats the problem.. who's discretion is it? Usually the officer who has been assigned to it. Even if the neighbours approve or support the proposal, they can still knock it back and then I'll have to start again, as after this, its either approved or not, and thats the end of the process with this council.

The worst thing is.. we had a pre-consultation with the council, they identified 2 things which may have been an issue. We put the plans in, those 2 items were brought up. We addressed those 2 items, and then the plan had to go to community consultation (which I thought was weird).

When it was advertised, I found out why it had to go to consultation.. there were 6 other items they identified which we were not told about AT ALL.. they simply put them in the community consultation form and advertised it that way. I'm told they do this ALL the time, and its an extreme dog act on behalf of the council. If they had told us about these 6 things before, we could have tweaked them and then we'd have been sweet.. but now its gone to consultation, if it gets refused, thats the END of the process!

NONE of the items raised were breaches of the R-Code.. they were simply outside their design guidelines which sit alongside the R-Codes.. and some of them were extremely contradictory.

For example, the roof pitch allowed under their guidelines is 30-45 degrees. Ours is listed in the consultation advertising as "flat, 7 degrees and 10 degrees". For one, we don't have any flat roof anywhere (there is a parapet which hides part of the 7 degree roof, and the council has not looked at the plan properly and just assumed it was a flat roof). The second thing, they say the roof should be 30-45 degrees and their guidelinse are such that the roof does not add bulk to the elevation and does not cause undue overshadowing. Well, a 45 degree pitched roof not only adds bulk, but creates more shadowing than a fucking 7-10 degree skillion roof!! Tell me how that works?

[Jumanji]

Apologies for the thread hijack, peoples thoughts and opinions on Gemmil & New Choice?

Gemmil is pretty good mate, you'll hear good and bad when it comes to project builders. Same with basically anything with something thats as competitive as housing.

[INSINR8R]

Brendan is building with Gemmil, had issues trying to get the contracts drawn up in less than the 12 weeks they quoted. Eventually got them to halve it.

Also, the guy he was dealing with abused our finance broker.

But they did everything Brendan wanted to do in the house he is building.

[jr]

Joe,

let me know how you go as well, I have a friend in strategic planning at ToV. She's been very helpful for information on my planned reno's which makes a change from most council staff, goes to show the will help if they want to!

[Joe]

Whos your friend?

Strategic planning, I'm tight with.

It's statutory planning that does new houses and renos.. my brown paper bag doesn't work in that department

[Bomber]

my brown paper bag doesn't work in that department
Try filling it with cash instead of Ciabatta :D

[jr]

Daniella Mrdja.

Don't think I know anyone in Statutory planning, will ask my old man though.

Too bad Nick Catania isn' the mayor anymore, my dad and him are mates.

[RELEASE]

Gemmil is pretty good mate, you'll hear good and bad when it comes to project builders. Same with basically anything with something thats as competitive as housing.really like one of there designs and the guy I'm dealing with is a champ.
There's always good and bad stories about builders I get that but as my mate used to work there as an estimater I didn't hear anything bad (not that there isn't)

Brendan is building with Gemmil, had issues trying to get the contracts drawn up in less than the 12 weeks they quoted. Eventually got them to halve it.

Also, the guy he was dealing with abused our finance broker.

But they did everything Brendan wanted to do in the house he is building.can you please pm me the guys name?

[INSINR8R]

No idea man, I'll ask Brendan or if he sees this he can PM you.

[mitchy]

Thanks for that mate.. the plan has gone for advertising now, as some parts of it lie outside the Council's design guidelines (NOT the R-Codes).

The problem is, their design guidelines basically suit a very simple design, upper level smaller than the lower level, 45 degree pitched roof, garage set to the side of the house... simply not an option in this suburb (given the frontages range from 9-13m for the most part), which makes it even more baffling.

They're not saying that its strictly enforced, it is flexible at their discretion, but thats the problem.. who's discretion is it? Usually the officer who has been assigned to it. Even if the neighbours approve or support the proposal, they can still knock it back and then I'll have to start again, as after this, its either approved or not, and thats the end of the process with this council.

The worst thing is.. we had a pre-consultation with the council, they identified 2 things which may have been an issue. We put the plans in, those 2 items were brought up. We addressed those 2 items, and then the plan had to go to community consultation (which I thought was weird).

When it was advertised, I found out why it had to go to consultation.. there were 6 other items they identified which we were not told about AT ALL.. they simply put them in the community consultation form and advertised it that way. I'm told they do this ALL the time, and its an extreme dog act on behalf of the council. If they had told us about these 6 things before, we could have tweaked them and then we'd have been sweet.. but now its gone to consultation, if it gets refused, thats the END of the process!

NONE of the items raised were breaches of the R-Code.. they were simply outside their design guidelines which sit alongside the R-Codes.. and some of them were extremely contradictory.

For example, the roof pitch allowed under their guidelines is 30-45 degrees. Ours is listed in the consultation advertising as "flat, 7 degrees and 10 degrees". For one, we don't have any flat roof anywhere (there is a parapet which hides part of the 7 degree roof, and the council has not looked at the plan properly and just assumed it was a flat roof). The second thing, they say the roof should be 30-45 degrees and their guidelinse are such that the roof does not add bulk to the elevation and does not cause undue overshadowing. Well, a 45 degree pitched roof not only adds bulk, but creates more shadowing than a fucking 7-10 degree skillion roof!! Tell me how that works?

when they say flat, they dont actually mean flat per se, considering you need a minimum pitch for water run off. a flat roof is just a term used for a low pitch roof.

also, you would get more overshadowing from a parapet than you would from a higher pitched roof.
overshadowing is taken at a certain time of the day, and i can guarantee you the pitch of the roof does fuck all considering the shadow is calculated on the sun being on a much steeper angle.

the council probably knows more than you give them credit for, make sure YOU know what you're on about first. ;)

[Joe]

Considering the parapet is predominantly on the Southern part of the roof, there is no overshadowing issues to my neighbours to the West and East.

Minimum roof pitch for run off can be as little as one degree if the roof is designed properly.. you should know this.

[mitchy]

i do know you can go as low as 1 degree with certain roofing materials, i'm not sure how that affects my point though.
obviously i don't know what you're building, i'm just giving you the basics on points you brought up.

i'm not always out to get you, joe.

[Joe]

i'm not always out to get you, joe.

I appreciate that, because I was about to tear shreds off you.. I know you know what you're talking about because of your line of work.

I should have explained myself a bit better... the council literally listed under "proposed design" in the consultation submission, the three roof types, when I only have two. It's not a matter of interpretation of the roof pitch, its literally incorrect.. I could ask them to change it, but they would have to start the timeline again. I know this because my friend (see below) had a mistake in his and asked them to rectify.. the time period reset after they reissued his community consultation form. Not keen, considering its been in planning since April.

They even get antsy about the type of materials you use. In my case its colorbond, but if it was anything else, they'd have an issue with it (tiles are recommended against in some areas of this council).

What annoys me the most is that they're stifling innovation. Not saying what I am building is completely unique, but if you want to be even a little bit creative, which I'd like to be because I plan on living here for a long time, they are not conducive to that at all. I've got a mate who is building his place down the road (he's an architect and he designed the place himself), and he is having even more trouble than I am.

[regi]

I went to uni with Daniela - is Peter still at subi?

Joe, whilst they can be dicks - and appear to be in this case, if you fight it you might end up in a worse position because like you said, the application of the guidelines is at the officers discretion (well, not really - its their coordinator or manager who will make the call)

I would get on the front foot and let the stat manager know that you are willing to make some changes to the plans before advertising finishes, rather than have the application refused (get it in writing). Then, once it goes to Council you can wave that at the councillors saying that you were willing to make changes but the planners didnt budge. Guidelines are exactly that, and if you can justify your position re: your roof pitch argument above, usually the councillors will take that on board.

If you wanted to build something in Rockingham the likelihood is that we would approve it, as long as its not stupid and breaking any obvious laws. Unfortunately thats just what you get from inner city LG's which don't have anything else to keep them busy :)

[Joe]

Daniella Mrdja.

Don't think I know anyone in Statutory planning, will ask my old man though.

Too bad Nick Catania isn' the mayor anymore, my dad and him are mates.

Ahh haven't heard of her.. I know Tory Young though, she's really awesome to work with and is helping out with some initiatives going forward in relation to a few projects I've got in the pipeline.

If you're Italian and you, or at least one of your family, doesn't know Nick Catania, then theres something wrong :P We've known him for many many years.. he used to bring his car to my old mans Service Station back in the early 80s, and that's how the family got to know him.



Joe, whilst they can be dicks - and appear to be in this case, if you fight it you might end up in a worse position because like you said, the application of the guidelines is at the officers discretion (well, not really - its their coordinator or manager who will make the call)

I would get on the front foot and let the stat manager know that you are willing to make some changes to the plans before advertising finishes, rather than have the application refused (get it in writing). Then, once it goes to Council you can wave that at the councillors saying that you were willing to make changes but the planners didnt budge. Guidelines are exactly that, and if you can justify your position re: your roof pitch argument above, usually the councillors will take that on board.

Thats the advice I was given by someone else I spoke to in the know... so that's why I'm tending not to make any waves apart from having a whinge and calling them 137 times to see how they're going with my application :P

Stat manager has been fairly okay so far believe it or not.. when the community consultation advertising missed its start date by 4 days, he said that he'd do the internal legwork at the same time as the community consultation to shave 4 days off the end. I will wait and see how this pans out though. It's mainly the slackness and lack of foresight that has shat me off the most, as I've mentioned above. I've dealt with many councils on other issues in my previous line of work, and I must say, not everyone in every department is complacent. Seems to be statutory planning that just goes along with the government imposed deadlines and ticks whatever boxes they're allowed to tick, rather than working with people to suit individual circumstances.

We're not conceding too much on the items raised, as they're well within R-Codes and other regulations which work alongside their design guidelines (which are exactly that.. guidelines, not regulations) so we wont hit them with the whole "we'll work with you on this" thing until after the consultation period ends... not willing to tell them now and they'll just expect it from us, rather than finding the middle ground with them.

I don't want to get any councillors involved.. I've already called in a favour with them, and I now need to repay that (not anything dodgy, just contributing back to the community in some way to show that I work on a give and take basis, not just a take and take basis).. would rather save it if I need them in the future for something :D

I'll leave it at that for the time being. Thanks for the advice on everything so far everyone.. I knew I could count on AL to be a sounding board for my concerns, lots of knowledgeable pingpingpingpings in here :D

[Jumanji]

i do know you can go as low as 1 degree with certain roofing materials, i'm not sure how that affects my point though.
obviously i don't know what you're building, i'm just giving you the basics on points you brought up.

i'm not always out to get you, joe.

There is alot more factors than just that.

[magic1]

the construction of a roof is not exact, when you have a roof of 1 degree and construction imperfections this can lead to ponding of water, causing extra loads and potential leaks.

i would never recommend less than 2 to 3 degrees.

but im only a pretengineer

[Jumanji]

the construction of a roof is not exact, when you have a roof of 1 degree and construction imperfections this can lead to ponding of water, causing extra loads and potential leaks.

i would never recommend less than 2 to 3 degrees.

but im only a pretengineer

3 deg I would agree to say as a minimum, is you have aircon or are going to run a ducted system 6deg as a minimum or do steel trussing throughout that part out the roof. Also you will have box gutters throughout to stop pooling of water as well.

[huggy_b]

box guttering....welcome to never finding that damn leak.

[Jumanji]

box guttering....welcome to never finding that damn leak.

Only if your roofie is a spastic

[d1mitch]

^^lol ive seen quite a few tradies, and there is every chance that is possible haha

[Azrian]

box guttering....welcome to never finding that damn leak.

So true although we did find ours and its now fixed with alot of silicon

[Jumanji]

So true although we did find ours and its now fixed with alot of silicon

Best way ive found post construction is getting one of those slot cutters from bunnings and putting the holes on the one side with a drip tray with a fall and a pip that feeds into the main S/W pipe. Did it for my dads places works a treat.

[mitchy]

There is alot more factors than just that.

do i need to repeat it 137 times? i said the basics.

i never (through choice) put box gutters in my designs, they are more trouble then they are worth.

[heavyduty1340]

Only if your roofie is a spastic

Well I had the fucken spastic

7 years later the pingpingpingping still leakes

Result - one house for sale, and one new house getting built with NO FUCKING BOX GUTTERS x137

[Jumanji]

do i need to repeat it 137 times? i said the basics.

i never (through choice) put box gutters in my designs, they are more trouble then they are worth.

If you feel as though you need to, personally i think its a bit of overkill. Besides the fact that you've taken the pun completely out of context. But never mind.

[heavyduty1340]

Thats all cool mate - I took the joke different to you, but was still all in fun (and I still hate my box gutters)

[suburban]

Senior Estimator for a Building company here,I have been in this industry for 7 odd years. Some advice for you;



In the way of building companies here is my view;

Redink Homes - Couldnt organise a root in a brothel, most of the staff are overseas and they are having huge issues with supply currently.
Summit Homes/Lifstyle/New Gen/ Easy Start - Again the same as above.
Wow Homes - Good homes great products very fresh and modern and the houses are built properly not cheaply
Amano Homes - Same as Wow.
Home Buyers - Dont even bother.
Dales - Again good company great product built really well. There are some teething problems with some houses but most are ok.
BGC - Dont even bother.
Aveling - Not bad to build with bit pricey
Residential 101 - I have alot of friends here and they can help you.
Scott Park - Good Houses, cheap, good designers, good houses.


I am more than willing to give you some specific advice if you would like it and I also run a small business to be an independant assessor of the house during varying stages of contstruction. I can meet you on site to dicuss any issues you would like and also check the plans to see if there are any irregularities. I have my builders reg, and basically we can nut out any problems you may have with the house an liase DIRECTLY WITH THE SUPER.

I also have multiple contacts in relation to people in all facets of the industry and different companies so I can help you there too.

PM Me if you have any questions, more than happy to help.

for a hero with his ticket, you tend to talk a bit of shit mate

what are you basing your above list on
- what the internet has told you?
- what your 'mates' have told you?
- you have actually stepped out of those four walls and seen what actually happens on site ?

I work for one of those builders in that list, as a building site manager. Ive got 10 years to my name from a drafting, drafting and design, concrete supervisor and building supervison so i have a pretty fucking good clue of what is considered shit, and what is correct. Read and take in what you want people, dismiss if you think you know better..

Any of the builders in that list will provide a fucking good home. At the end of the day, they are all using the same materials, and the jigsaw fits together the same way.

Aslong as the supervisor knows his shit and has the balls to pull his trades into line, you will generally have fuck all problems. Sure, little things here and there might be missed, or might be left until a later stage (like a blown out brick under the facia, or a big chip on your door sill). Most of the time, the supervisor knows about it, but waits until later to fix it - why ? TIME MANAGEMENT. No point pulling plasterers off a job if they are setting that week, no point getting a brickie to drive three suburbs away to replace one brick and fill one profile hole when he can do it a few weeks later when he is working down the road.

Supervising is not just about knowing how to build, it is also about knowing how to be organised and run an effective trade base. If something doesnt get done when you think it should - RELAX

For someone that "also run a small business to be an independant assessor", Borgz, i wouldnt pay you a cent if you find it easy to bag out builders. You either dont get much work, or you have little clue as i find it hard that every home you have inspected from builders listed above would be consistently bad enough to warrant "dont even bother" and "couldnt organise a root" comments.

One of my places was a scott park, and the tiling was average, painting ok, cabinet work average and plasterwork SHIT but you dont see me bagging the builder as a whole.

FYI, i knew of the person Wow was using for their ticket, and he wasnt much chop...
RedInk is shit, but 101 are good ? You do know Scott Park (person, not builder..) owns these ?
Homebuyers is shit, but Dales is ok? Again, owned by Gary & Dale - same vision is shared, same systems and procedures ?
Aveling is not bad? Homebuyers shit, Yet Michael Aveling and Mick Cunnold both worked at homebuyers for about 15years ?

These type of theads shit me to tears.

[suburban]

Someone in the know about the building industry feeling kind and keen to lend me 5 min of their time to answer a few quick questions about building defects?

I'm in a 3 year old home that has a few issues with cornice cracks, leaking common wall to shower and external paint on rendering fading/cracking...

Can you please send me a PM and I'll write back with some questions. Cheers

Simon, feel free to PM and hit me up - i can give you some answers (but without seeing the house in general, i can only make an educated guess)

Cornice Cracking - non structural
Generally cause due to movement between two different style of materials being brick and timber. Cornice covers the area of movement, and when this move, it shows as cornice cracking.
Reasons for cracking generally include:
- Settlement
- Plasterer not cutting his float at the wall plate (strip of timber fixed to top course of bricks which joists and remainder of roof load off)
- Too much glue used to set cornice
- Strutting beams above openings

Leaking shower on common wall.
- Breakdown of waterproofing membrane (shower floor / 600mm up walls / corners often waterproofed)
- floor waste breaking above membrane
- cracked tile and capillary action of water moving UP wall
- Shower has 200mm high hob, tiler has used 2c fastwall plus mud / glue to achieve full tile height, water gets in and moves along onto common wall)
- silicone to floor / wall junction leaking (this should be replaced every 12months if used)
- top course of tiles not grouted (condensation forms and works its way downwards and creates damp patch over time)

External Paint / Render
- Crazing in render (caused by incorrect mix)
- fading paint (certain colours are not as UV stable as others (think of red cars and oxidisation) - Rendered homes require paint maintenance, Generally every 3 years you should freshen up - its not maint. free
- render has not been sealed properly
- paint has been thinned (pissed up with water to get more coverage per litre)
- insufficient coverage (coates)
- flaking can be caused due to moisture and lack of sealing. Also lack of substrate preperation (not brushing loose sand off wall prior to painting)

If you need anymore help. Let me know

[Drift_R32]

I'd like to add to the cornice cracking one..
As that's my proffession and ive done maintainence for nearly all those builders mentioned


Render lacking concrete and been practically sand and lime giving nothing for cornice to hold to

Metal structured roofing.. Movement on these with heat and cold is just stupid, have had to no more gap an entire vbgc home because of this-20 tubes later

To much acid in cornice adhesive, because of rates paid on said builders been shit. Tradesman will add citrus acid to adhesive to make it last longer in turn getting more work done
This weakens the adhesive.

Not enough adhesive on cornice..

That's just Afew.

[suburban]

fixing cornince cracking with no more gaps is one of the worst things you can do as the shit shrinks and doesnt give you a true square edge between wall / cornice in which to cut in when painting

[Drift_R32]

Lol mate I dunno how much you think you put in..

When I did it you can't even tell it's got gaps there.
I've seen plenty of painters be liberal with it. But if you Have half a brain you don't put it on that thick

Lol was a bgc supervisor that told me to do that cause it was either that or smash down the entire house and re cornice it.

You get what you pay for personally..
You want to build through a large company who rely on quantity not quality to male their money, then that's what you get. For a first house that's fine.. nice little house and land package

But I've seen what goes on and don't expect perfection.

Supervisors won't rip chunks off their brick layers or plasters etc if they do a shit job.
They are to worried about losing thier tradesman..

[suburban]

wont rip chunks from their trades ?

mate the industry is the lowest its been in ages. That means there are plenty of trades chasing work

this is where we seperate the wheat from the chaff

i put one of the plasterers on notice today due to not knowing how to use a level too well, his finish is good, but shit aint always square
i also put a 10gang bricklaying team on notice over a number of things, but not their quality

as for no more gaps. I know how the shit works and i know how it can turn out. Painters probably shouldnt be too liberal with it when it comes to patching plaster / gyprock.

if you are in the ceiling game, other then it being harder to apply then normal plaster filler, why the hell wouldnt you use superfine flushing compound ?

i would probably suggest you dont try play the cool card about knowing what supervisors do and dont do. Bit of a generalisation eh.. There are a few too many people out there who believe they are google builders because their mate is a bricky or they read something on a forum

[Drift_R32]

Mate supervisors tip toe still around their plasterers and brick layers
They always have and always will..

And superfine?
Stick to supervising I think

If cornice has come away from the wall your suggesting I use something as brittle superfine to "hold" it place while allowing it still flex and move?

I still stand by what I say..

The difference in what goes on/acceptable in a bgc compared to a Webb and brown home is laughable
Which comes back to you get what you pay for.




wont rip chunks from their trades ?

mate the industry is the lowest its been in ages. That means there are plenty of trades chasing work

this is where we seperate the wheat from the chaff

i put one of the plasterers on notice today due to not knowing how to use a level too well, his finish is good, but shit aint always square
i also put a 10gang bricklaying team on notice over a number of things, but not their quality

as for no more gaps. I know how the shit works and i know how it can turn out. Painters probably shouldnt be too liberal with it when it comes to patching plaster / gyprock.

if you are in the ceiling game, other then it being harder to apply then normal plaster filler, why the hell wouldnt you use superfine flushing compound ?

i would probably suggest you dont try play the cool card about knowing what supervisors do and dont do. Bit of a generalisation eh.. There are a few too many people out there who believe they are google builders because their mate is a bricky or they read something on a forum

[Drift_R32]

I've dealt with supervisors from countless building company's big/small/commercial for ten plus years

I'd have some idea of what they do and what they try get away with.

[suburban]

no, im suggesting you use it for cracking, not rebonding. Its a crack due to the cornice pulling away from the fucking set. Hardly structural.

ill stick to telling pingpingpingpings how to do their job and when, you stick to walking around on your stilts.

[INSINR8R]

So yeah, going to sign my contracts today...

http://www.allfunnyfaces.com/pictures/How_Exciting.jpg

Exciting.

[Joe]

So after the mess with the council, our community consultation came back with nil objections.

The council cleared everything, except for 2 minor things... well, we thought they were minor.

One was upper level setback (top level to be behind lower level, not in front of) and the other was garage setback (meaning the garage has to be behind the main line of the house instead of in front like 99% of other houses out there).

So back to the drawing board.. because pushing the upper level back means the stairs have to be flipped to the other side of the house, where the laundry and bathroom were supposed to be, and moving the garage back means the living area is pushed back, which puts the games room very close to where my shed will be.

The architect has come up with a new design which is not only way more cohesive than the old one, but it looks more contemporary.. AND it meets ALL council regulations. Will probably end up costing 1-2% more at the worst, but this isn't a huge deal in the scheme of things.

Final sign off is this week and planning amendment will commence next week. Fingers crossed!

[YOUR MATE]

Good luck with the new design Joe.

I got my contracts and gave them a look over. Half the changes I asked for aren't drawn in there, albeit the ammendments are there and I'm being charged for them. So have to wait for my sales person to get back from leave before he can send them back to get fixed. Also still being charged a truck load for site works after the site survey came back saying it's got fuck all clay etc and should be sweet, so I've questioned that.

Puts going to council back another few weeks which is annoying. I just want to get it under way. After taking a drive around the development today and seeing how quickly some of the places progress and how good most of them look I can't wait.

[Lasoya]

Ive sent back 2 plans already and received my final amended plans this week, signed and returned, slab should go down early september :)

[Joe]

I got my contracts and gave them a look over. Half the changes I asked for aren't drawn in there, albeit the ammendments are there and I'm being charged for them. So have to wait for my sales person to get back from leave before he can send them back to get fixed. Also still being charged a truck load for site works after the site survey came back saying it's got fuck all clay etc and should be sweet, so I've questioned that.

Make sure everything is in the contract, addenda, and plans, and that it all matches, and especially make sure its in the plans that are going to council.. because you don't want to do an amendment, unless you like a month or so of wasted time.

It gets even more confusing when you've got half a dozen or so versions of plans, my builder submitted a previous one by accident but we were lucky it didn't affect anything (as it was mainly some kitchen cabinet orientation that was different).. but if there is wall changes, it could possibly breach or affect the councils planning regulations and you may have to do an amendment or variation.

Also, question EVERYTHING that you don't think is right. The worst they can say is no, but if its a genuine mistake, you get it amended..

[ovaxitd]

What you will find also is your site works estimate is more than required, meaning if it comes in less (normally does) then you have money in your pocket at the end..

missus used to hate having to call people and be like " o hi, just doing your block, found some rock, that will be an extra 20k" not their fault but they try and be conservitive and better calling and say "guess what it came to less so now you have a credit !!!"

good luck.

[YOUR MATE]

So a bit more of an update. Block that was advertised as an A class block came back form engineers report as an S class, meaning quite a bit more work to get it up to spec to build on. Managed to get some money back from the real estate agent. Not enough to cover it but due to all the other fuck ups the contract to buy the block had lapsed, so really they could of told me to fuck off. I don't care though, it's finally all go ahead. Sign papers for loan tomorrow, settlement next week. Picked all my colours, tiles, window treatments etc last week and pre start is next Tuesday.
Upgraded a lot of things like floor tiles to larger ones, wall tiles in bathrooms to large rectangular ones, tiled the floors in the storage areas and the entry from the garage to the kitchen.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d28/Nthn_suss/Houseplan-2218.jpg

[mr_rotary]

My thoughts...
1. Tile passage between garage and laundry. Tile WIL to match otherwise an odd bit with carpet.
2. Move master suite door 1000mm into passage.
3. Tile coat to entry. Otherwise again an odd bit with carpet.
4. Add door to laundry or passage. Noise of washing machines shit me plus it will help with energy ratings.
5. Beware of heating/cooling your family/dining. Large space connected to your entry, games, study and laundry.
6. No robe to Bed 2?

[YOUR MATE]

As I said in my previous post, WIL, space from garage to kitchen near laundry and coat spaces are all tiled. Bed 2 has a robe, it's in one of the 50 emails but I'll make sure it's there come pre start next Tuesday. I agree with moving the door for the master suite though, will mention that. As far as heating and cooling goes, that can't really be helped. Wall insulation should hopefully make it easier.
Other little changes not on there are the ensuite vanity and mirror now go wall to wall, no little gap. Kitchen splashback is to height of range hood. Space for fridge is slightly wider and we have moved the sink in the laundry closer to one wall and have a bench top running the length to the opposite wall, with tiling above to suit.

[Halle Terry]

Needs doors windows etc.

[Sebdullah]

Needs doors windows etc.

not this shit again

[cplagz]

When you come to signing your final plans (the ones they will build off) make sure EVERYTHING is on them that you want. If it's not on the plan, they won't put it in.

[Skitzo]

Does anyone work for a building company? I too am looking into pruchasing my first home. Market is crazy competitive atm. Looking to go established but seeing what is also available if i build.

I have found a floor plan i like for a rear block, and was wondering if there was anybody on here that could tell me what their company could build it or similiar for.

[SimonR32]

That reminds me... Got some basic preliminary plans for our new pad, let me know your thoughts builder peoples.

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy15/SimonR32GTR/Capture-9_zps89b1d045.jpg

[MadDocker]

Slider instead of swinging door on the en suite shower.
See if you can turn the door leading from the store to the backyard into a larger gap with a roller door for better access. You'll appreciate this when doing anything like mowing, gardening etc.
Check out how much they want to slug you to extend the alfresco out inline with bedroom 4 if you don't have plans for the space. Will make the outside area massive and shouldn't cost too much more material wise.
Window from kitchen out to alfresco might be an idea. Will seem more open, let light in and give you're mrs. something to look at while cooking dinner instead of a wall. Depends what you have there with cupboards etc.
You might be wasting space in the office with that entry. Could make that storage room & robe a lot larger and move the door down. You'll use the storage more than the extra space in the office probably.

[SimonR32]

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy15/SimonR32GTR/Capture-9_zps89b1d045.jpg


Slider instead of swinging door on the en suite shower. Maybe, like the semi frame less look though. I'll hunt down some similar and check them out
See if you can turn the door leading from the store to the backyard into a larger gap with a roller door for better access. You'll appreciate this when doing anything like mowing, gardening etc. Already changed that, just not updated on plan. Getting a manual roller door
Check out how much they want to slug you to extend the alfresco out inline with bedroom 4 if you don't have plans for the space. Will make the outside area massive and shouldn't cost too much more material wise. That's going to be lawn there, wouldn't be able to extend the alfresco that far regardless because of the outdoor living requirement in zoning
Window from kitchen out to alfresco might be an idea. Will seem more open, let light in and give you're mrs. something to look at while cooking dinner instead of a wall. Depends what you have there with cupboards etc.That wall is getting bifold window across the whole thing and the stone benchtop is going to extend through the window for an outdoor breakfast bar. Most the windows have not been drafted yet

Good suggestions, pretty much covered them all already which is handy :)

[Turbo2.6L]

How wide is the garage without the store?

[SimonR32]

How wide is the garage without the store?

5.8m which I believe is standard? I wanted the store the full length of the garage but we are waiting on titles to be issued so we can see if there is a 6m setback requirement for the garage. If not I can make the whole length of the garage/store go to the boundary.

[MadDocker]

Sounds like you've thought it through well.

Might not be to your liking but you could also extend your front portico to the garage, pave underneath and have somewhere to sit out the front. Could possibly work the planter box into it. If you have kids or a nice view, a space to sit out the front is nice.

[Turbo2.6L]

Nice!
Standard width is a pain if you are parking 2 cars in there, definitely widen it if possible!
We extended ours an extra metre each way to accommodate 2 large cars & still retain some room to get in/out of them without banging doors. Also did high ceilings & boxed the rear manual door so as to get maximum clearance for such things as loaded trailers. Something to think about...
Also, i'd move shower to opposite side of the vanity & make it full length with a fountain shower head in the middle.
Lastly I'd get rid of the store in dining room to open up study.

[SimonR32]

Slider instead of swinging door on the en suite shower.

Found these, looks good. Hopefully not too expensive!

<div><a href='http://www.houzz.com/photos/1916657/frameless-sliding-shower-door-contemporary-showers-hong-kong'><img src='http://st.houzz.com/simgs/8dc1511d009865f9_8-4863/contemporary-showers.jpg' border=0 width='500' height='376' /></a></div><div style='color:#444;'><small><a style='text-decoration:none;color:#444;' href='http://www.houzz.com/photos/contemporary/showers'>Contemporary Showers</a> by <a style='text-decoration:none;color:#444;' href='http://www.houzz.com/professionals/building-supplies/hong-kong'>Hong Kong Building Supplies</a> <a style='text-decoration:none;color:#444;' href='http://www.houzz.com/pro/slidingdoorhardware/ningbo-tengyu-metal-products-coltd'>Ningbo Tengyu Metal Products Co.Ltd</a></small></div>

[MadDocker]

Looks good. Will give you more in the bathroom and harder for the mrs to swing the door open and hit you when you leg past for a shit while she's in the shower.

[regi]

the garage setback is weirding me out

i cant think of a single reason why you wouldn't be able to build the garage/store on the boundary

unless there is a detailed area plan which modifies the garage front setback, i've never seen a garage side boundary setback modified like that...

could just swap the store to the rear or opposite side of the garage if there is an issue though!

[Joe]

You haven't had garage issues until you've tried getting a planning approval with the City of Vincent.

I had to redesign my whole house because the council won't allow a garage that is in front of the main line of the house (this of course varies as to what they interpret the main line as).. In fact, it has to be substantially behind it... 300mm I think. As I couldn't chop 800mm out of my garage length, and I couldn't just push it backwards, we had to redesign and change the elevation completely to accommodate the new garage position.

Also, you can't build your garage wider than half the width of the house, even with a narrow block. So I wasn't able to go wider than 6.1m with the garage.

[regi]

Joe, those are standard R-Code provisions so its not just Vincent, pretty much all metro councils would have an issue - unless they have a policy which varies R-Code requirements.

The garage has to be setback 0.5m behind the house.

[DRKWRX]

Is that just in the City of Vincent? what about houses with three car garages??

[YOUR MATE]

As has been said, wider garage the better, but you're already onto that. It cost me next to fuck all to widen garage and roller door a metre. I wish I'd gone wider now with a rear roller door like Dean has suggested. I'd look at taking a bit out of the office and having a double door entry. Big spacious hallway looks baller and makes moving furniture a hell of a lot easier. Also if you're building in a new estate 95% of other places will have double front doors. Window from kitchen to alfresco, even if it's only thin if you have top cupboards, would look good. Office has a robe so it can be called a 5th bedroom?

The whole layout is pretty fkn smart I rekon. The only thing I see and don't like is the bulkhead above the bath at 25c. Who's it with? Dale Alcock are doing 31c throughout now as standard. Could be worth trying to bargain with that? Higher ceilings in the garage look mad, too. There is an owner/builder lot near us and the garage is noticably bigger. Sitting there like a boss.

I learnt so much after I got the ball rolling. I'd change so much next time round. Still, I'm happy with what I got.

Regi: My garage isn't set back? None of the ones I've noticed going up really are.

DRKWRX: Not sure if it comes into it but the 3 car garages around me are all normal 2 car ones with a 3rd single one that's set back a bit from the main line at the front. Not sure if it's because of design or rules.

[regi]

no way man, big single front doors are the go these days

much more functional and a lot more secure!

[YOUR MATE]

no way man, big single front doors are the go these days

much more functional and a lot more secure!

I thought that too, then after getting a look at them changed my mind. After seeing the dead bolts that come in them security isn't an issue unless a cars driving through them. But even if you go single, you can get a size above what's drawn. Bigger the better.

[Turbo2.6L]

1.2 single is fine, doesn't need to be double. 900mm single is what you find on older houses & doesn't look so flash
Will post my plan up when I get a chance as there seems to be lots of knowledgeable people on here that have built before. I've only bought established up until now...

[Turbo2.6L]

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p233/03XR6T/CF1848E6-9585-48BF-88BD-427414891550-1455-000000D63AEF0EE4.jpg

Modified plan on the left. Open to ideas as these are only prelims

[DRKWRX]

Ive been doing quite a few big Alu pivot doors lately, agree with the big hallways with high ceilings thats what we will be doing.

[Joe]

Joe, those are standard R-Code provisions so its not just Vincent, pretty much all metro councils would have an issue - unless they have a policy which varies R-Code requirements.

The garage has to be setback 0.5m behind the house.

They have their own Residential Design Guidelines that varies many R-Code requirements, specifically the ones that affect the aesthetics of the houses.

They can vary many of them if it suits the aesthetics of your elevation, as there is provisions for this throughout the guidelines, but they try really hard to push you into following the R Codes rather than their own guidelines.

Only after some pushing and shoving will they approve something that comes under their own guidelines.

Worst of all, you can show them a dozen recently approved homes in the area that have a similar feature to your own rejected planning approval, but they don't want to know about it.

Took me 12 months of back and forward with some stupid pingpingpingping ranga leso planning officer to get everything approved.. And it saddens me to see people getting the exact same thing done in their own area with no hassle.

Plus don't get me started on the crap I've seen in my area in the past 2 years.. 300k double story base spec homes on million dollar blocks that completely blow the design guidelines out of the water, and the council hasn't even flinched in approving it.

[Lump]

Open to ideas as these are only prelims
nice layout in general, with the theatre adjoining the lounge.

i think the kitchen could use a bigger pantry & maybe some more bench space down the wall near the window.
needs a door (sliding maybe) to the ensuite.
also no door on the laundry?

[Turbo2.6L]

Cheers mate, will definitely bring those things up with the missus. Although kitchen is actually very large when you're standing in it.
Liked the open ensuite & laundry but might put doors on for resale. Suppose everyone won't be thinking like I am as far as no family to think of

[racegtst]

My builder lodged my 2 storey plans with 4 car garage with the city of Canning. Only change was the 1st garage/Store room had to move 300mm forward and put a window in to make it look more like a part of the house instead of the garage. Street appeal was councils issue.

They have a 60% rule that states that the garage can't be more than 60% more than the total width or some shit like that. Lucky i have a 20m frontage. The other 3 spaces has a single and a double roller door at the front on the same plane.

A couple of pics.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/20290_10151143681671818_2114313328_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/32148_10151303797516818_403897058_n.jpg

[SimonR32]

the garage setback is weirding me out

i cant think of a single reason why you wouldn't be able to build the garage/store on the boundary

unless there is a detailed area plan which modifies the garage front setback, i've never seen a garage side boundary setback modified like that...

could just swap the store to the rear or opposite side of the garage if there is an issue though!

Apparently the R-code specifies that if the garage is a boundary wall it has to be set back 6m... Hence the store starts at 6m, make sense?

It's not the worst thing in the world. I would use the areas for bins/storage etc

[SimonR32]

As has been said, wider garage the better, but you're already onto that. It cost me next to fuck all to widen garage and roller door a metre. I wish I'd gone wider now with a rear roller door like Dean has suggested. I'd look at taking a bit out of the office and having a double door entry. Big spacious hallway looks baller and makes moving furniture a hell of a lot easier. Also if you're building in a new estate 95% of other places will have double front doors. Window from kitchen to alfresco, even if it's only thin if you have top cupboards, would look good. Office has a robe so it can be called a 5th bedroom?

The whole layout is pretty fkn smart I rekon. The only thing I see and don't like is the bulkhead above the bath at 25c. Who's it with? Dale Alcock are doing 31c throughout now as standard. Could be worth trying to bargain with that? Higher ceilings in the garage look mad, too. There is an owner/builder lot near us and the garage is noticably bigger. Sitting there like a boss.

I learnt so much after I got the ball rolling. I'd change so much next time round. Still, I'm happy with what I got.

Regi: My garage isn't set back? None of the ones I've noticed going up really are.

DRKWRX: Not sure if it comes into it but the 3 car garages around me are all normal 2 car ones with a 3rd single one that's set back a bit from the main line at the front. Not sure if it's because of design or rules.

Kitchen to alfresco bifold window is going to be like this...

http://www.dalealcock.com.au/Images/Products/Archipelago/Breakfast-Bar.jpg

Yeah robe in office is so technically you can use the house as a 5x2. I like big single front doors, any furniture can go through rear of garage and through stacked sliders into the main living area.

Bulkhead at rear is due to the rear setback. Unfortunately because of the length of the house and size of block the setback is less than 1.5m so the bulkhead has to be built under the eaves. I did up the basic design and then got a draftsman to do it up properly. It's going to be with a small private builder.

[sensei_]

make sure you get all the smart wiring points adjacent to the electrical points in every room. bedrooms, study, theatre, ward in robes (great for chucking a wireless access point), passage, kitchen (behind fridge and near counters). it may sound silly now, but once you move in, you will want to have the flexibility.

i remember when i did mine i was only allowed a limited amount of points - if i could go back in time, i would make sure every room has a couple of data point, and lots of power points.

also depending on your needs, you may want your power/data points to be 1m from the ground. reason? because it is much easier to control your power without having to duck under the table and get in a compromising position just to turn on/off the power or unplug the cables.

another point would be to install 3 phase power for runnings things like lifts, air compressors, and even powering on site equipment like grinding concrete if you plan on getting terrazzo. it may seem like overkill today, but once you have moved in, it is often much harder to install not to mention more expensive.

[racegtst]

make sure you get all the smart wiring points adjacent to the electrical points in every room. bedrooms, study, theatre, ward in robes (great for chucking a wireless access point), passage, kitchen (behind fridge and near counters). it may sound silly now, but once you move in, you will want to have the flexibility.

i remember when i did mine i was only allowed a limited amount of points - if i could go back in time, i would make sure every room has a couple of data point, and lots of power points.

also depending on your needs, you may want your power/data points to be 1m from the ground. reason? because it is much easier to control your power without having to duck under the table and get in a compromising position just to turn on/off the power or unplug the cables.

another point would be to install 3 phase power for runnings things like lifts, air compressors, and even powering on site equipment like grinding concrete if you plan on getting terrazzo. it may seem like overkill today, but once you have moved in, it is often much harder to install not to mention more expensive.

Good points.

3 phase is a very smart idea, I think they charged me $300 for this build and was about the same last time. Also useful if you are running aircon.