What's the 4WD for me

[fsbk]

hey guys, let me start by saying i don't know much about 4wd vehicles so i'm just looking for some general advice. i'm in the market for a brand new 4wd. i'm not quite sure what i want, but i want something that can do serious off-roading (not a hyundai i45, something that can tackle rocks/sand/mud/hills etc etc)

so far the only one that i've driven and liked has been the mitsubishi challenger. i'm not too sure what else is out there.

my budget is around 25k-45k-ish and the car must be new (no used cars) for tax purposes. thanks in advance!

[mr_mike]

Do u have a family u need to fit in?
Do you need a ute, dual cab or single cab?

How serious off roading do u want to do?
Do you want to mod it or leave stock?

Just saying u want a new 4wd for $25-45k doesn't help much

[fsbk]

sorry. would prefer minimum 4/5 seats. not family at this stage. not too keen on the dual cab, but wouldn't rule it out. i probably wont be doing serious off roading all that often, but would like the knowledge that the car can handle it. it will most likely be used for unsealed roads, some beach driving etc and any obstacles along the way (roads like cape leveque etc). would want to leave it dead stock, as i will be leasing the vehicle.

[Buckets]

Territory AWD, Wheels mag proved it was alright offroad.

[mr_mike]

Territory AWD, Wheels mag proved it was alright offroad.

except they have less clearance than ur average small car, no low range and low profile road tyres

yeh they go great offroad

i seen one up Lano dunes once get stuck in a soft sand bowl at the base of the dunes, he coulnt go more than a meter without getting stuck. In the end was skull dragged out by a Patrol.

[Douche Bag]

Surely its got to be one of these after pgc's review..

http://www.carsales.com.au/all-cars/bncis/details.aspx?R=10802649&__Qpb=1&keywords=&Cr=4&__Ns=pCar_RankSort_Int32|1||pCar_PriceSort_Decimal |1||pCar_Make_String|0||pCar_Model_String|0&SearchAction=N&__N=1216%201246%204294704202%204294962746%20416%20 904&silo=1011&PriceTo=416&seot=1&__Nne=15&__No=0&trecs=7&__sid=12CB54BF3AF7

[Niva]

1978 lada niva

[shifted]

1978 lada niva

Was waiting for this!! LOL

The VW Amarok looks awesome though!

[mr_mike]

Top pick would be a Patrol or Cruiser but for your money you would be buying base models.

For what you want to spend personally i would go a Isuzu Dmax or Holden Colorado essentially the same vehicle both have solid engines, good ground clearance and good towing capacity.

These days with Hilux's your just paying for the name as far as reliability and offroad ability they are on par or even below the 2 i mentioned above.

[NVIOUS]

If you want to leave it dead stock, JK wrangler unlimited will go pretty much anywhere, if you can afford the extra $$ get the rubicon model & you get diff locks too - unstoppable offroad.
Can always remove the rear hardtop & use it as a semi-ute back too if needed.

Otherwise there isnt much in that price range apart from dual cab utes

[Boza]

Top pick would be a Patrol or Cruiser but for your money you would be buying base models.

For what you want to spend personally i would go a Isuzu Dmax or Holden Colorado essentially the same vehicle both have solid engines, good ground clearance and good towing capacity.

These days with Hilux's your just paying for the name as far as reliability and offroad ability they are on par or even below the 2 i mentioned above.

problem is busted arse dmax/colorado will depreciate like fuck where as hilux are proven to be a much better car with 10 x better resale....(reliability or offroad ability comment debatable also..)

wagon choice be hard to go past patrol as youd get a slow na diesel 100 for that money or a hideous on fuel petrol 100...later model zd patrol (alot less chance of engine failure) or gu1-3 td42 would be the pick..(having said that i rate prados highly if want a smaller wagon thats more than capable offroad)

as for ute would be hilux or d40 nav dually....

[Passage GT]

i'd probably go the jeep in that situation also, great off road and apparently the diesel with off road pack is an excellent combo, good on fuel too, though not as good as a rubicon off road obviously.
might just scrape in a new dx patrol with that money but still 20k short of anything with a landcruiser badge.

[South]

Have you ever wheel seriously, or have you just seen pictures and thought that's cool?

Perth has very limited 'serious' 4x4'ing and those tracks that are 'serious' you would not take a brand new truck on, unless you don't care about dents and broken bits stopping you from going to work on Monday...

If you just want to do the powerlines, then I would say Pajero is in your price range and will do the trick.

If you want to step up to the 'serious' stuff then your only option in your range is the Jeep, but then modding it will see you go 10k up on your budget.

DX patrol would be stock, and shite and again 10k up if you want to play 'serious'

dual cab utes, limited travel with IFS and leafs, but you can bounce over things, can modify in your budget as well.

Landcruiser is out

[exa666]

the new ford ranger comes out soon i think ive got the 09 model and all ive done is put 31 inch mud terrains and its pretty capable for what it is goes anywhere my mates 80 series cruiser goes but it lacks rear seat space so passengers get pretty annoyed pretty quick

[[Jacek]]

dont forget the Suzuki Jimny. Cheap and fuel efficient, capable off road. But small.

[mys1]

If it has to be new and you don't want a dual cab,

The challenger is a good unit, nothing really comes close as a new car with those features for that price!

[RMX]

On saturday I picked up my new Challenger.

Took it out Sunday (Still on the factory HT's, dropped to 20psi), With the rear diff lock and centre diff lock I was able to haul through some bog holes no one thought I'd get through.

I'll post up some pics/video tonight.

With some bigger rubber and a couple of inch lift and a snorkel, It'll be unstoppable.

I'm very happy with it, Done almost 600km since saturday and averaging 9.3L/100 (Manual), Sits just on 2,000RPM at 100km/h and is really very quiet on the road.
Turning circle isn't as bad as I expected, Once it's on boost it hauls.
After the 1500km inspection I'll block off the EGR, From what I've read there is a big improvement under 2,000RPM as it gets on boost much quicker.

[1cut808]

Unfortunately $45K won't get you to many decent 4x4's unless your looking at Great Wall's etc. Certainly wont step into a new Cruiser or Patrol for that.

[Rhys]

Surely its got to be one of these after pgc's review..

http://www.carsales.com.au/all-cars/bncis/details.aspx?R=10802649&__Qpb=1&keywords=&Cr=4&__Ns=pCar_RankSort_Int32|1||pCar_PriceSort_Decimal |1||pCar_Make_String|0||pCar_Model_String|0&SearchAction=N&__N=1216%201246%204294704202%204294962746%20416%20 904&silo=1011&PriceTo=416&seot=1&__Nne=15&__No=0&trecs=7&__sid=12CB54BF3AF7


after having one for the weekend i would wait untill they fit a bigger engine , way to under powered.

New Mitsi Challenger as said, mate has one with lift and tyres and seems to go everywhere.
Did have one for an evaluation vehicle from Mitsi and was mighty impressed with what they can do for a standard car

+1 for Challenger

[ovaxitd]

Why not new Toyota fj cruiser??

[Passage GT]

you guys need to price up a patrol and not look at rrp:)
i was quoted under 50k for one with steel bar, spotties (which are included free atm anyway) dual batteries, tow pack, winch, and power sockets in the back etc, was a few other extras i've forgotten atm, and that was for an st which has the full electrics and rear air con etc
could get a dx with the free steel bullbar and spotties for 45k easy.
the mitsu's would be good too i think, i test drove the triton glx-r which shares running gear and it was a good drive.

[Jizz-Lebrity]

Slight hijack but what's the general opinion on VQ40 powered Navara's?

I've pretty much got my heart set on a D40 ST-X 4x4 to use as a daily/jetski tow car that will go OK on the beach/dunes etc.

The way I see it; ~200KW DOHC 4L, relatively light, 6 speed box...etc, should do reasonably well for $30k for a neat new example.

Discuss.

[mr_mike]

they have not much in the way of ground clearance for a start.
A guy at work bought one brand new, the soft tarp lasted about 6mths before it started to split and crack making it useless. 2years on window seals started to crack and lift and about this time the paint on the roof and around the windows began to fade and lift.
This was a brand new $40k+ vehicle that never seen of road and was mostly used for work commute and runs to the garden center.

They are small things but if small things like this start to happen on a vehicle that has had a very easy life i would be hesitant to put any strain on one.

[ovaxitd]

Why not new Toyota fj cruiser??

[RMX]

Why not new Toyota fj cruiser??


Petrol only = gayness.

[NVIOUS]

Petrol only = gayness.

Gimme petrol anyday, fk'n hate diesels, I work on em all day long. Smelly dirty slow pieces of crap :P
New diesels aint the old reliable dinosaur the older donks used to be, way too much electronics and cramped engine bays these days.

[mys1]

Toyotas 4 litre V6! Seriously can't go past it, thirsty, and plenty of power, what more do you want form a big monstrous 4wd!

its all about carbon foot print, the bigger it is, the more winnign you are!

[mr_mike]

Gimme petrol anyday, fk'n hate diesels, I work on em all day long. Smelly dirty slow pieces of crap :P
New diesels aint the old reliable dinosaur the older donks used to be, way too much electronics and cramped engine bays these days.

I want a diesel but one of the older turbo diesels. Love the sounds of a turbo diesel with a straight thru exhaust.
Plus the ability to drive thru deeper water once you get a snorkel on.

[Buckets]

New diesels aint the old reliable dinosaur the older donks used to be, way too much electronics and cramped engine bays these days.

+1 my old 200 Series was the most useless piece of shit I've ever owned except for my rotang, sure it had plenty of grunt but you couldn't trust it to work because the electrics were rubbish.

[South]

I want a diesel but one of the older turbo diesels. Love the sounds of a turbo diesel with a straight thru exhaust.
Plus the ability to drive thru deeper water once you get a snorkel on.


You'll have to put a toyota one in, the nissan's overheat and have no power HAHAHAAAA

[mr_mike]

You'll have to put a toyota one in, the nissan's overheat and have no power HAHAHAAAA

Duramax or Cummins v8 diesel would be my pick

[Passage GT]

You'll have to put a toyota one in, the nissan's overheat and have no power HAHAHAAAA

lol, fail troll.

mate drowned his 200 series last week, got stuck in a creek crossing and is still drying out his carpets.

i prefer driving petrols as well but for fuel economy i need a diesel, even my mates diesel needed 2 jerries when we went to karijini, my petrol would have needed the jerries just to get to tom price and then fill everything up again to get home, too expensive and too much fucking around.

[South]

Troll reply I think???

200 series is electronic is it not? Hence why Mike wants an old school diesel without electronics... TD42t has nothing on a 1HD-FT, even the 12HT tromps the TD42t :P

Duramax is electronic right?

[MrSparkle]

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good opinion.

[BOSS 290]

+1 my old 200 Series was the most useless piece of shit I've ever owned except for my rotang, sure it had plenty of grunt but you couldn't trust it to work because it's a Toyota.

*fixed.

To the op, take a look at a Challenger like Rhys said. Good warranty, good on fuel, capable off road.

Get Sean from ASG to fit a Chip-it unit and it'll really get up and go. I've got one fitted to my Pajero, makes a diesel heaps more fun to drive.

[BOSS 290]

Why not new Toyota fj cruiser??

'cause it's a fucking girls car!

[Gladio]

I dont want to drag it out even more off topic but im going to be upgrading my work car also and was really keen on a tray back 08 landcruiser with the VDJ79R 4.5l V8 turbo diesel... Are they good motors?

[Patrick]

Very torquey motors, seem pretty tough. Fit an exhaust and it will sing along through higher revs (die down around 3,000rpm) I would imagine. We drive the new ones at work, not sure if there much different. Also alternator is underneath everything on drivers side, pretty prone to stuffing up mud/water.

[South]

Father in law has a '10 plated VDJ79R with all the fruit, anyways we bought there old HDJ80R off them that also has all the fruit and our truck weighs a shite load more and rapes the ute, V8 has no torque down low compared to the I6. I can pop the clutch on a hill and it will roll forward and keep going...

200 series twin turbo goes like the clappers, but the ute falls short.

[Yarms]

Drive a v8 turbo diesel tray back at work .done numerous trips from laverton to leonora and leinster. Go hard but as you can imagine thirsty and over priced.alternator sits at bottom and if not washed after being through mud it can fuck out quite easily. Correct me if im wrong.

[Buckets]

Yep the alternator's are useless and the starter motors live in the valley under the intercooler so when this dies your looking at a full day job to fix it.

The 200 series are so heavy they don't have dual tanks so your range isn't great and god forbid you smash your tank off road because you don't have a spare. You may as well drive around with all the windows open because they dust sealing is appalling. As already mentioned they (both the 200 series and v8 utes which I use for work) lack the low rev torque the old I6 had. The 200 series is also a massive car and larger than a lot of other 4WD's so if you do go proper offroading you wind up having to be bulldozer and widen some of the track as you go (the paint work loves this) The seating position is all wrong, you sit far too high up in the seat, as such I used to drive around with my eye level being the area where the windscreen meets the roof.

They cost a fuck load to service (mine was leased so it wasn't an issue for me) and they are severely over priced for such a sparsely equipped vehicle, the 200 series I leased was around 90k drive away for the base model diesel ! That kind of money can get you a TDV6 Discovery SE which is a far nicer piece of kit (they had the 2.7 at the time and I chose the 200 series because the 2.7 was slooooooooow, new 3.0 is apparently better)

I loved the 80 series and liked the 100 series (never owned them but used for at work) but the 200 Series is a soccer mum taxi that's too rough and big to be at home in the city but too soft for the bush.

[Rhys]

200 series does come with dual tanks now , was only the early ones that lacked this due to GVM weights being too much on C Class licence.

Early 1VD engines are prone to use oil and have power issues, again the later ones seem to have fixed all these issues.

Alternators are in the worst place ever as Daisy found out several times in his and Sean from ASG has had numerous replaced due to this poor positioning.

100 i would love with a 1HD-FTE but they still fetch HUGE money so an 80 with a 1HDT would do the job nicely.

[Passage GT]

lol @ as the single turbo v8 having no low down torque, i spent 10 hours a day in these things at work, pretty much all they have is low down torque, won't set the world alight at a set of lights but the low down torque is very impressive, can literally drive along with no throttle, just off the clutch through to fifth easy.
certainly better than the old 1hz but on the road the 1hd in my mates 100 series feels gruntier than the v8, all of ours chew oil including our 2010 models and air con is a regular failure.

[BOSS 290]

Until the alternator fails.....

[jaybee]

without making another thread that is very similar, i am after a 4x4 around the 10-15k price range. i would prefer a duel cab ute and then fit a canopy on at a later date as i'll be karting around my mtb's a fair bit, and that would be the best option. i'd also consider wagon type 4x4's as long as there is plenty of room in the back. turbo diesel would also be preferred!

[mr_mike]

Hilux, Rodeo or Triton for a turbo diesel dual cab in that price range you should be able to pick up a pretty clean one with mods.

Patrol GU wagons fall in that price range but wont be turbo diesel. GQ wagon Diesel for about $10k would pick up a neat mid 90's model then spend another 2-3k putting aftermarket turbo kit on it.

Should also be able to find a 80 Series Landcruiser in that price range.

[Steppo_GT]

In addition to Jb's question how many K's tend to be too many on a vehicle like this? Eg rebuilding diffs, gearboxes, engines etc major stuff?

[jaybee]

jeep grand cherokee's seem to fall into that price range too, what are they like?

[Buckets]

A good mid 90's Pajero can be had for around that coin. I have one at the moment as backup car and aside from the clutch going after my brother tried to do a skid in it I can't fault it.

[Passage GT]

the alternator thing seems to be common and it's all the more surprising cause i'd be surprised if any spent more time driving in mud than our work cars, all our roads on site are dirt and all the access roads are dirt, they literally spend 90% of their time driving dirt roads, and with the large amount of rain over the last 6 months it's been muddy as well, the undersides of them constantly covered in mud, might see if they've had any kind of guard fitted or something.

[Gladio]

Hmm ok thanks for the imput peeps, my plan was to put a custom body and remove the tray and occasionally take it off road+ beach fishing. What other solid cars could I be looking at for same sorta deal without the headaces?

[esky]

the alternator thing seems to be common and it's all the more surprising cause i'd be surprised if any spent more time driving in mud than our work cars, all our roads on site are dirt and all the access roads are dirt, they literally spend 90% of their time driving dirt roads, and with the large amount of rain over the last 6 months it's been muddy as well, the undersides of them constantly covered in mud, might see if they've had any kind of guard fitted or something.

it's more dunking the alt in mud then driving down dirt/mud roads. mud bogs, swamps, playing in muddle puddles. If think ross had 2 replaced and sean even more.

[NVIOUS]

it's more dunking the alt in mud then driving down dirt/mud roads. mud bogs, swamps, playing in muddle puddles. If think ross had 2 replaced and sean even more.

Done a couple of alt's, a/c comp, starter, turbo, and engine all in a V8 troopie at work, absolute bitch to work on - cut a nice big hole in the inner guard to get the turbo out haha. Gets a flogging in a U/G mine though, nothing but headaches with it.

[DT95WA]

Done a couple of alt's, a/c comp, starter, turbo, and engine all in a V8 troopie at work, absolute bitch to work on - cut a nice big hole in the inner guard to get the turbo out haha. Gets a flogging in a U/G mine though, nothing but headaches with it.

gets a flogging? the heap of shit only revs to 2k at best of times, they should fuck it off and get another 6cyl for us.

[South]

lol @ as the single turbo v8 having no low down torque, i spent 10 hours a day in these things at work, pretty much all they have is low down torque, won't set the world alight at a set of lights but the low down torque is very impressive, can literally drive along with no throttle, just off the clutch through to fifth easy.
certainly better than the old 1hz but on the road the 1hd in my mates 100 series feels gruntier than the v8, all of ours chew oil including our 2010 models and air con is a regular failure.

Drive a 200 series then to see the potential of the engine, because of the manual the VDJ79R has to be a gutless pig. If you think a 1HDT has more grunt, jump into a truck with a 1HD-FT or 1HD-FTe, the V8 falls behind for pulling power. For the work horse trucks, the single turbo V8 is a backward step.

It's just like the 3L hand grenade, will always be a backward step from the TD42t, however both are gutless, one is just built like a brick shithouse. Emissions were the only reason the straight 6 diesels in both camps got shut down.

[Passage GT]

i think you misread me, i've been in several 1hd-dte and i said they have more grunt in general driving, all of these have been auto 100 series and the auto helps having a converter etc,
but to say the manual v8 has no torque down low is misplaced, they have excellent torque down low and in 4x4 situations are an excellent engine in low range crawling etc
i even agree with the nissan comments, in everyday driving (driven a manual td42t 2004 gu and a 2003 auto zd30) the zd30 actually goes harder, but the td42 has 20+ years of legendary reliability and in aftermarket tuning can make really impressive power,
the new gtx30 on a td42 making over 260rwhp with 35s on a gu, would go 300 easy on 31s.
old mans best mate has been touring the country for the last 18 months towing a huge van and he's just ordered a bigger one, has a 2005 gxl 100 series ifs with the 1hd and 5 speed auto, at first he was talking about upgrading to a 200 series or even a 76, but 12 months later i was speaking to him and he wouldn't sell the 100 series for the world, drove the 200 and couldn't justify the price and the 76 was too small and uncomfortable, and more expensive than his 100, so now he's gonna get an exhaust and chip for the 1hd.

[esky]

seans VDJ76R made 257rwhp with exhaust and tune.

[pazrs]

TD42 fo' lyfe. True truck donk.


Do the 12mm plunger swap and get them up around the 110+cc / 1000 @ 110bar and they hump!

The toyos have some good power plants but puss diffs compared to GU's.

[Bogrolls]

i found my VDJ79R to have excellent low down torque when i took it out to karrathas jump up area yesterday so i would disagree with the "no torque" comment. but the alternator position worries me as does toyotas starter position which has scared me since first seeing a 1UZ years ago. will look at getting it chipped up later in the year for sure to improve the midrange, as ive been spoiled for RPM by my really rev happy small block chev patrol but i am well impressed with the machine so far although time will tell when next week exverything shits itself and it cost US debt spec to fix haha

apologies for hijacking the thread with cruiser ute stories for a thread devoted to 25-45k 5 seater purchase advice, which i would say D4D hilux dual cab which i have for work and can be made very suitable for mild offroading with basic cost effective upgrades. i find them to have gold star resale and decent reliability
also the auto i have drinks wayyyy more juice than the manuals. and the shifter is like a puzzle maze to get the f*$king thing into the gear you want and are constantly looking down at the stupid thing haha