View Full Version : Property Sale
Nelos e46
15-09-2009, 07:21 PM
Hi people, got a dilemma. I am selling my house which is under fixed term tennacy which started on 01-06-09 ending 01-06-2010 (1 year), the problem i face is that the couple purchasing the home want to move in straight away. IS there a way or a process i can follow where the law supports my actions to get rid of the tennats.
Since this forum has so many members i though someone might be in the realestate industry.
thanks for the help in advance.
RGVFAST
15-09-2009, 07:56 PM
i think legally you cant do squat,
best option would be for the new owners to move in after lease is up,
or for you to compensate the current tennants for moving out sooner
Logie
15-09-2009, 08:09 PM
i work in a law firm, i will ask this question for you 2moro.
You can break a lease at any time, but it depends on whether the tenants agree or not.. you may have to compensate them.
P.S. who sold your house for you?? The agent SHOULD have told them they were on a fixed term agreement when they showed them the house...
P.P.S Have a read of Part V of the Residential Tenancy Act... you can break leases if they are not a fixed term agreement, including after selling the property, but if they are fixed term, you can't do anything.
http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/wa/consol_act/rta1987207/
magic1
15-09-2009, 08:40 PM
the lease you provided them give them security. if they have breached the terms you MAY be able to get rid of them. or option 2 is compensation or option 3 ask them!
DanWA
15-09-2009, 08:44 PM
Yeah when i bought my house there was tenants involved, i couldnt do nothing and the previous owner wasn't willing to compensate them.
Your only other option is to try evict them on a technicality but that could lead to your house being damaged.
cpanameno
15-09-2009, 09:08 PM
My sister had the same happen to them, only she was the tenant. The owner offered a full refund of the bond and for them to move out immediately - 'ASAP' without having to 'clean up', in other words pack and go.. You could try that if it sounds ok to you. If you don't mind doing the cleaning that is. Only problem is that they can decline your offer.
That was generous of your sister.. I would have asked for at least 1 month period to find somewhere else and move out, and I would have wanted that time rent free.
Nelos e46
15-09-2009, 09:42 PM
ah k thanks for your replies fellas.
trippn32 appreicate your efforts let me know.
The problem is i am hearing two stories some say yes you can if your selling the house, others say no you cant.
I sold the house my self, so no agents where involved.
The tennants have not breached any of the rules in terms of payments, damage etc...
The buyers are saying you can tell them to get f**Kd. Otherwise they will cancel the sale sorta thing, thats what there implying.
Any help will be appreicated, i am simple i just want to sell my house lol
DanWA
15-09-2009, 09:44 PM
I couldnt say that, however me and the previous owner were going through an agent, like Joe said offer them a month of free rent.
Nelos e46
15-09-2009, 09:51 PM
yea, well at first i had a chat.
I said: yeah i am selling the house and was wondering if there was anychance you could move out sooner.
They said: Ah okay well you do know its expensive to move.
I said: I have a truck business as you know i can move you
They say: no not transport other expenses.
I just left it at that.
DanWA
15-09-2009, 09:54 PM
Fuck them they sound like idiots, is there lease through REIWA?
Nelos e46
15-09-2009, 09:57 PM
yea it is, isnt everyone?
DanWA
15-09-2009, 09:58 PM
Bummer, if you had an agreement with them instead, you could tell them to fuckoff tomorrow, now you will need to be nice to get them to leave early, depends how much you want to sell your house?
Nelos e46
15-09-2009, 10:02 PM
yeah i sorta need to sell.. lol
ill talk to them again see what they say, but when you think about it your like its my fCUking house Get the Fk out hahaha
DanWA
15-09-2009, 10:04 PM
Doesn't work that way if you don't got an excuse to break lease thats through REIWA unfortunately, i had to wait 5 months to move into my house!!
DrNick
15-09-2009, 10:41 PM
Are you allowed to put the rent up during the lease?
Perhaps you could jack up the rent by 100% so that its cheaper for them to move than stay.
Sleekman
15-09-2009, 10:53 PM
they can dispute rent increase and then it would be reviewed by a 3rd party (cost will be split)
Lonewolf
15-09-2009, 10:59 PM
no, you cant up the rent until the end of the lease period (unless stipulated in the lease, even then it cant be extravagant cause you will get taken to court).
A lease is a binding contract between you and the tenants, it works both ways.
They cant not pay rent, and you cant just kick them out. The house is theirs until the tenancy is up.
Best bet is to come to some sort of arrangement with the tenants, and if you really need to sell, then it may involve compensating them.
Lesser of two evils if you need to sell the house now.
evil.e30
15-09-2009, 11:12 PM
DENNY CRANE!!!!!!!
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j3/11051960/Crew%20List/denny.jpg
Are you allowed to put the rent up during the lease?
Perhaps you could jack up the rent by 100% so that its cheaper for them to move than stay.
You can but you need to give them sufficient notice under the Residential Tenancy Act, which is 60 days notice and it has to be later than 6 months after the commencement of the lease.
Plus, if there is no provision in the lease for a rent review, then you can't do it.
I had a similar situation when i sold a rental a few years back. Offered them $1000 to cover their costs and gave them the last 2 weeks free rent.
You offered them a lease and they are entitled to stay for the period of the lease. That provides security for both parties so cannot simply change your mind if you want them out.
Just make them a cash offer and work with an agent to find them a new rental.
kneedtotinkle
16-09-2009, 08:09 AM
REIWA contract is binding. You cannot terminate the tenancy agreement without them being caught out on a technicality. Unfortunately the only way you are going to get the house sold is by negotiating with the tenants to move out. In all honesty, they dont have to move for your benefit. They can stay there in their secure tenancy and let you lose out on your deal. You will have to offer some sort of incentive and convince them to leave your premises.
Like Joe said, 1 months free rent to find somewhere else to live, or double bond back etc.
Best of luck.
stop being such a pingpingpingping to your tennants
let them live out their time on the remaining lease and THEN sell your place
you only just signed them up in JUNE - if you need to sell your place you should have done so back then
cplagz
16-09-2009, 09:00 AM
stop being such a pingpingpingping to your tennants
let them live out their time on the remaining lease and THEN sell your place
you only just signed them up in JUNE - if you need to sell your place you should have done so back then
Pipe down hero. Who's to say he wasn't trying to sell it, or possibly his financial situation has changed.
Unfortunately, no you can't just kick them out.
doriae86
16-09-2009, 09:20 AM
Equitable interest mark! Where's your legal analysis?
SircatmaN
16-09-2009, 09:49 AM
yeh I was gonna say thats pretty rough on the tenants aye, theyve just moved in and now your trying to rush them out. I moved into my house not long ago and moving is defeniatly a headache especially if your rushing them, I wouldn't want to move either.
Lonewolf
16-09-2009, 12:03 PM
if i was your tenant, then yeah i'd be wanting a lot of compensation, moving house is pain in the ass
SINISTR
16-09-2009, 12:45 PM
I'd suggest having a chat to them again, but be prepared with some information in terms of helping them out of the house. You said you can move them, fair enough.. thats a $$$ saving. Maybe do some quick research around the area where you're house is and see whats available within the money they are paying you, maybe a little more - find the perks. Call the agents of the new rental and explain the situation - ask what the waiting period is for contracts to go through if they agree to move... and so on.
Do some running around - if you do a bit of that and come back to the tennants with options ie: i found these houses here for you eg: only 2 kms from here etc etc, its same $ or less/more. I spoke with the agent and we can try and rush through the application, your bond will cover their bond, i'll compensate you $$$ for the inconvenience etc etc...
You'd be surprised what a bit of homework can do and you never know you may be lucky and the tennants will agree.
In terms of selling your house - mate - i hope the purchases are signing something before you move these people out... imagine if you moved them out and the buyers decided they can't afford it or they simply changed their mind - cover yourself that way too!
In terms of selling your house - mate - i hope the purchases are signing something before you move these people out... imagine if you moved them out and the buyers decided they can't afford it or they simply changed their mind - cover yourself that way too!
That would then be the agents problem, it becomes a mis-representation if the agent gets you to move the tenants out prior to the buyers signing up to purchase the house!
Nelos e46
16-09-2009, 12:55 PM
cool fellas cheers for all the comments. Ill have another chat and ask them what can i do for you to help you move out earlier if they say nothing then i guess ill have to seek purchasers that are willing to wait.
Thanks again
Can I ask... are you using an agent?
Logie
16-09-2009, 01:10 PM
ok well after seeking out help from my firm, these are the answers which follow from 2 of the commerical legal team.
A.From the Department of Commence website which is where you will locate the required Termination Notice (Form 1C).
Sale of the rental premises. If you intend to
sell the property, then the agreement may be
terminated after you have followed the proper
procedure. If you sell the premises and the Offer
and Acceptance form requires vacant possession
to the purchaser, you may give notice to your
tenant on a Termination notice (Form 1C), ending
the tenancy no sooner than 30 full days after
the date you give them the Notice. This form of
Notice may be served only after the acceptance
of the offer on the property becomes a binding
contract on both the owner and buyer.
A tenant can give two full days notice to end a
B.The general position is as follows:
The Residential Tenancies Act protects the tenants interest under a fixed term tenancy. Unless there is a default in the lease that would entitle the owner to terminate the lease the tenants are entitled to stay until 1/6/2010.
If the tenancy had only been on a month to month basis then he could have given 30 days notice of the sale of the house and forced the tenants out.
If he has entered into a contract for the sale of the property without putting in a special condition that the buyers acknowledged that the tenancy would continue until 1/6/2010 he is in even more strife as the buyer may be entitled to charge penalty interest from the settlement date to the date on which the seller able to deliver vacant possession (1/6/2010).
hope this clears things up mate.
kneedtotinkle
16-09-2009, 01:53 PM
Same as what I said prior, you dont have any other option other than to find them guilty for something in order to enforce termination of the tenancy
OR
Help them out, make it worthwhile for them and then you have vacancy.
Joe - He isnt using an agent, so in theory he is royally fucked if he tries to terminate without reason or sell without vacancy.
Moral of the story = Do it the correct way otherwise you will get walked on in a court of law, they can sue you for $$$$ against the breaching of the tenancy. Give them an incentive to vacate and make sure you get some form of deposit, signature etc on the property from the buyers prior to moving the tenants out as you will know (only if you have propositioned the tenants to definately in writing to be vacating by the neccessary date - prior to sale date), it wont be nice if you have no rental income and a property which isnt sold.
Fark, playing with fire.
Agent's aren't cheap, but thats because they mitigate your personal risk by taking on the risk in its entirety.
So easy to get sued for anything in the property game.
cplagz
16-09-2009, 02:14 PM
Equitable interest mark! Where's your legal analysis?
Lease is a proprietary (legal) interest, not an equitable interest as it can be registered, and I hope for their sake it is.
However, on that. ... if the lease is not registered then its in personam and only a contractual obligation. But I digress.... :p
Residential leases don't have to be registered Marc, only commercial leases! :D
vee571
16-09-2009, 02:37 PM
Laws were placed to protect tenants from these situations.
And landlords if they wanted to leave early.
Use money/guilt.
Give them bond in full to pack&go plus $1000 (which you will probably make up in sale), offer move etc.
cplagz
16-09-2009, 02:43 PM
Residential leases don't have to be registered Marc, only commercial leases! :D
Don't have to be, but I suppose that's where the RTA comes into play. They could place a caveat on the sale of the property if they want to be khunts about it. Commercial don't have to be either if they are under 3 years.
Drift_R32
16-09-2009, 02:45 PM
im moving house in 2 weeks because the owners are selling and ive written on the new house contract i want a year lease. if i moved in and then was told a month later they wanted to sell if fukn ream them for all they got considering its not exactly fukn easy to find another house and move all your shit. if the financial situation changed for the owner then tough shit its not the tenants fault last i checked they paying part of if not most of your mortgage for you.
cplagz
16-09-2009, 02:54 PM
im moving house in 2 weeks because the owners are selling and ive written on the new house contract i want a year lease. if i moved in and then was told a month later they wanted to sell if fukn ream them for all they got considering its not exactly fukn easy to find another house and move all your shit. if the financial situation changed for the owner then tough shit its not the tenants fault last i checked they paying part of if not most of your mortgage for you.
They can only give 30 days notice if it's a periodic lease. Otherwise you can't remove a tenant on a fixed term lease until the lease expires or the breach the contract in some way shape or form.
They can only give 30 days notice if it's a periodic lease. Otherwise you can't remove a tenant on a fixed term lease until the lease expires or the breach the contract in some way shape or form.
30 days if house is being sold
else 60 days if asking for vacant possession (kept in same owners name)
welcome to residential.. protect the tenants :)
Drift_R32
16-09-2009, 05:51 PM
hence why i signed the lease for a one year term...the house i was in was my missus boss's word of mouth agreement her been a stupid bitch decides she wants to sell, tells us..then we find another house and say we are moving and she has a sad cause we arent gonna be there for home opens, yeh cause i love people invading my personal space every saturday for an hour.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.1.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.