Vn Calais Super6

[vnrockit]

Hi this is my ride a 1989 vn calais blue over silver
few years ago i ripped the n/a v6 out and dropped in a l67
factory supercharged v6 been a slow process getting it to where it is now
but there is still alot of work to be done on it before its where i want it
few months ago a cracked the 11sec with an 11.90@113mph
this was with a stock motor still just bolt on mods still more in it yet
car is currently off the road with a few things happening to it as it should be
getting around to a few events later this year

i won't put up an pic's just yet as its got a few things being changed

any way specs

s1 vn calais
motor - l67 super 6
box - 4l60e stage 2 transgo shift kit and billet servo
diff - 3.45 spool
interior - vs statesman dash and seats
stereo - m90 @18000rpm
mags - vx clubsport 18s
mods - 64mm pulley, bye a2a intercooler plate, 600x300 front mount,
1.9:1 rockers, bye 85mm u-bend,85mm ls1 TB, 5% overdriven HB, 4" intake with bye carbon airbox, vs pacemakers with twin 2.5" s/s into single 3"

11sec pass
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will put more info up in a few weeks once everything is sorted
along with some pic's

[Tocchi]

you're neil (grampa)'s mate right?

i think he was showing me all the carbon fibre in the engine bay (for the intercooling) at the drags, if this is the car, then good work. engine bay looked sweet :)

[vnrockit]

yeah thats me engine bay will look abit different to when you seen it last
been busy your user name looks familiar like maybe off ultimate cruises or something

[Joe]

Bombed!

I love the Supercharged 6's, they have so much potential to go very hard with very few mods.

[Lonewolf]

nice, very sleeper also!

[Atomic_FD]

shit yea thats rowdy.

[waxdass]

stereo - m90 @18000rpm



quick spinna!

[adrenalin]

shit how awesome does that move off the line !

[lazy6]

looking awesome still dude gotta catch up for a drink soon!

[PAGZ]

nice run, what kinda power this thing put down?

[lazy6]

round the 300rwhp mark!

[ED40]

I hate how fast you guys can go down the 1/4 with the power you make!
Good build!

[vnrockit]

I have a dyno reading saying 294hp and one the week before the run in the clip getting 281hp @5000rpm i have a pretty flat power band

[Torquen]

farkn quick for not alota power! goos stuff mate, lookn forward to seeing some pics :)

[Mad_Aussie]

what kinda 60ft times u getting?

[SLEEKA]

With the way that took off 1.5-1.6 I reckon

Great combo, looks nice and clean and goes like a shower of shit :D

[SQUIDO]

hey dude me and a mate are half way through a super 6 build,64mm pulley..how much boost is that????

[vnrockit]

60' are slow with stock stall still in there was only getting 1.74 60' as traction wasn't the best at that time of the season
looking at getting a 3000rpm stall that should get me closer to 1.5's
With a 64mm pulley i'm seeing 13psi at the manifold but hoping to bump that up to 15psi this season

[vnformula]

Good to see ya on hear Pete, hopefully i can catch ya this season, Put up a pic of the plate to show off your handy work

[Gladio]

Fuck yeh that thing took off like a jet! Give any car on here a run for its money..

[evil1]

good lil thing you got goin on there mate
moves quick off the line

[PAGZ]

I cant get over how fast that thing moves off the line, slicks?

[space]

do you daily drive this car?

[vnrockit]

Hey ben your going to need a motor that runs first, blocks with no pistons don't go very fast lol

car was run here with slicks ran a 12.00@112.5 mph with 1.7 60' on et streets
on cheap 18" tyres best is a 1.9 60' but that was a while ago

and this car is used everyday to drop the kids off at school
car still drives like standard just goes real well when you mash the pedal

[TJ]

Best V6 blocks holden ever made

Forged pistons rods and crank from factory.

Add boost = fast. Nicely done.

[lazy6]

good to see you last nite at justins young man hopefully catch up again soon!

[vnrockit]

Yeah man good to see you to lol at you leaving
think will be meeting up in a couple of weeks for drinks anyway :beer:

[vnrockit]

Well new motor is run in and running well looking forward to new drag season
and events will get some pic's and vid's up soon

[vnrockit]

Well had motor freshened up fitted an xphot cam
also tryed a w2a setup results were good managed 329hp
need a bigger exhaust now as the single 3" is a restriction
anyway heres some pics will get some of the out side soon

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/329hp.jpg

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/w2aenginebay.jpg

[Bakerboy]

love that carbon fibre looks good mate

[Gladio]

nice, I love the ecotec super6's more pics of engine bay and mods!

[vnrockit]

thanks guys will get some more pics up soon
engine mods
stock bottom end
xphot cam
rollmaster double row timing chain
heads valves cut back and ports cleaned up
modded retainers and 105 springs
supercharger ported
42lb injectors
650hp w2a intercooler
st4 heat exchanger
n/a pacemakers single 3" exhaust
gearbox refreshed with transgo shift kit
modded stall 2760rpm

[lazy6]

looks awesome sounds awesome goes awesome had fun a few weeks ago in this man

[LooneyToons]

did u by anychance get that painted in carlisle? i think i might of painted this in 2007.

[thommo]

thats a good 40hp increase from before. when you heading down to the plex ?

[jivlah]

Hey, think i saw this today at the Skidpan, was doing mass skids :P.

i was on the other skidpan with the other group.

[vnrockit]

looks awesome sounds awesome goes awesome had fun a few weeks ago in this man

glad you enjoyed your flight lol


did u by anychance get that painted in carlisle? i think i might of painted this in 2007.

nope not mine but i work around that area


thats a good 40hp increase from before. when you heading down to the plex ?


went down a week a go ran a couple of 11's in street spec
going to change a couple of things then head back with slicks


Hey, think i saw this today at the Skidpan, was doing mass skids :P.

i was on the other skidpan with the other group.

that wasn't me was busy working on someone elses car :(

[wadragracing]

I thought these were heavy but I'm obviously wrong cause that's a pretty good speed and ET from around 300hp.

Good work :)

[ADZR8]

I thought these were heavy but I'm obviously wrong cause that's a pretty good speed and ET from around 300hp.

Good work :)

Kerb Weight (kg) 1395

So did i, there about the same as a VL

awesome times mate.

[vnrockit]

weight at motorplex scales was 1380 kg
but i have a carbon bonnet which take 40kgs off so would be 1420 for
standard vn calais
power curve was stronger low to mid range before i had car retuned with cam

[mitchy]

40kg (+ whatever the carbon one weighs) for a bonnet?
doesnt sound right to me, but if it is fuck me that's a heavy bonnet!

[vnrockit]

40kg (+ whatever the carbon one weighs) for a bonnet?
doesnt sound right to me, but if it is fuck me that's a heavy bonnet!

standard bonnet was 45kgs
carbon bonnet is 5kg

[vnrockit]

Couple more pic's of the engine bay ported and painted blower

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/blackm90front.jpg

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/blackm90.jpg

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/blackm90side.jpg

[Quivr]

Lookn good pete.

[VS50WA]

Best V6 blocks holden ever made

Forged pistons rods and crank from factory.

Add boost = fast. Nicely done.

Blocks are exactly the same as the Ecotecs only difference is the internals.

L67's have different pistons and rods. Gudgeon pins are larger and stronger then standard ecotec motors, and the pistons have a special coating and larger dish to decrease the compression ratio.

Other then that basically the same as an ecotec motor.

[VT SS]

nah the heads are different as the injectors go straight into the heads not into the lower part of the manifold.

compression was lowered from 9.4:1 in the L36 (ecotech v6) to 8.5:1 in the L67 (supercharged v6)

[Mistikal]

Blocks, heads, not same.

[vnrockit]

heads are the same just holes drilled for the injectors

[vnrockit]

couple of changes done ported heads and a few other mods
just fitted my new carbon battery cover up
should have it on the dyno soon for a tweak http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/newbatterycover.jpg

[vnrockit]

car was dynoed on bye perfomances new mainline dyno yesterday
results were 334.3hp and 879.3nm of torque

dyno run here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHXkD1S99C0

[Joe]

I'm assuming that torque figure is tractive effort, not torque!

Still, thats a great result!

[vnrockit]

nope thats torque in nm
has 1813lb of motive force
not sure if thats the same as tractive effort
theses motors don't make high hp but they do make torque i'll post dyno sheet up later

[sam5709]

fark, 14 secs into the dyno run she sounds bloody awesome when she leaps forwards, nice :D

[Torquen]

WOW! Blower whine much?? Sounds sweeeet :)

[vnrockit]

dyno sheet driving car now it feels so much better than before
feels alot faster while i have only gained 5 hp it gained 200nm of torque and it feels like it to i have advanced to cam abit since last tune

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/dynosheet.jpg

[vnformula]

nice work pete

[Rhys]

nice, more incentive to do the conversion to my VN now

[lazy6]

awesome figures pete!

[vnrockit]

thanks guys motor and tune done now time for the body going to start on that pretty soon with front bar to be custom made custom sides and rear bar to follow ;)

[31-EVO]

Impressive figures, love that blower whine on these things.
Out of curiousity, with the aftermarket blower pulley, do they have any missalignment issues ?

[vnrockit]

dyno run from a few nights ago getting a bit of valve float atm but that will soon be sorted

made 386rwhp with 886nm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2TSKZiCTGsA

[SSICK]

nice......couldnt stop watching the box in the background tho..

[ForgedV6]

nice......couldnt stop watching the box in the background tho..

DAMMIT! Now thats all i can see!

Good to see it on here Pete. Im hoping to get down to the workshop this Friday night.

[vnrockit]

Lol that's a bit of hood lining and that's all I look at now to haha

[mARC]

nice......couldnt stop watching the box in the background tho..

¬_¬ fek...

hot ride man, how did you go with body mods?

[vnrockit]

¬_¬ fek...

hot ride man, how did you go with body mods?

Nah I started on the front bar but have put it off so I can get running gears sorted
And not worried if I bin it at powercruise or somewhere looks will be the last thing I sort out want to have fun with it and not nana it around incase I get a stone chip in it

[vnrockit]

couple of vids on the dyno and a road test

http://youtu.be/BNMz7dllnas

http://youtu.be/fw8HXNHPgf0

[PSI 304]

Damn that whipple howls! 900nm's of torque would make this a handful aswell for sure. Nice work mate :)

[vnrockit]

Yeah whipple is a bit loud for my liking but it sure goes well heaps of low end power

[Jumanji]

That blower whine is fantastic, nice car man.

[DanWA]

Fuck thats alot of torque for a v6

[esky]

The torque figure is a crock.

Simple maths shows hp at those revs doesn't equal the torque quoted.

[vnrockit]

The torque figure is a crock.

Simple maths shows hp at those revs doesn't equal the torque quoted.

Lol Who said the torque is high in the revs your maths is a crock

[Lonewolf]

sounds nice.

His maths is correct, the power / torque equation doesnt change.
The graph is probably measuring tractive effort or torque at the wheels, not torque at the motor.

[DanWA]

My mates super 6 vn had crazy torque figure on justin's dyno to...

[vnrockit]

Nm at the wheels peak torque is at 3500rpm
Are you talking about jordans vn that would be around 500nm

Would you prefer I compare to a blown ls2 making 520hp and 700nm torque does that workout for you?

[Lonewolf]

issue is people relate torque at the motor when they read figures (as this is what the factory does), torque at the wheels isnt a valid comparison between different cars.
My astra makes more than 1000nm...

Still makes good power, so who cares :)

[DanWA]

not going to get into dyno argument

burnout.

[esky]

The dyno figure for torque is wrong. It most likely torque at the roller shaft.

Torque at the tyres is tractive effort or motive force.

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/dynosheet.jpg

Lets take max torque of 879nm at 70khp which is 3770rpm that your 'claiming'

879nm is 648 ft lbs of torque.

Now since torque is directly related to hp as you pointed out, the conversion is (torque in ft lbs x engine speed) /5252 = hp

So (648 x 3770)/5252= 465hp.

To have the 879nm your claiming at 3770rpm or 70kph, the car needs to be making 465hp......which it isn't.


Sorry , but your car ain't producing 879nm.

[vnrockit]

No I'm not producing 879nm of torque that was the old blower
Whipple made 940 at same rpm it's ok doesn't worry me if you calculations don't work out
They never have for theses motors
How's 11.9et@113mph with car weight @ 1440kg with 280hp does that work out right

[DanWA]

et's dont lie! nice time.

[esky]

lol....vn motors defies laws of physics.

280rwhp in car that weighs 3170lbs give theoretical best of 11.9@115mph.

940nm....lol.

[DanWA]

i'd assume its a l67 not a vn motor

[vnrockit]

Not a vn motor an l67 out of a vs fitted into a vn
So I theory every motor produces the same torque and horsepower
So I guess it's not possible for a car producing 370hp to make 1066nm of torque
Cause your calculator says so lol

[Lonewolf]

Not a vn motor an l67 out of a vs fitted into a vn
So I theory every motor produces the same torque and horsepower
So I guess it's not possible for a car producing 370hp to make 1066nm of torque
Cause your calculator says so lol

Yeah, it would make a peak of 370hp at 2500rpm, so probably a big diesel.

every engine has a relationship between power and torque and revs that doesnt change.
http://wentec.com/unipower/calculators/power_torque.asp

p.s. my astra makes almost 1300nm....
http://members.iinet.net.au/~lonewolf3/astra/power2.jpg

[DanWA]

no one is taking the piss vnrockit, just seems like a bit of a pattern coming out of justin's workshop

no one can deny the 11.9 run either, its nothing to blink at, most of the big talkers here won't get near a 11 second run

[vnrockit]

yes but your saying im full of shit which i dont like cause of your calculator
and if your after a pattern your mates vn coming in for a dyno run and dropping 25hp means its a happy dyno?
I fabricate and sell my own parts the main part is an intercooler plate for the m90 supercharger, this diverts the air to a front mount intercooler
rather than straight into the manifold in doing this we can spin the blower faster with a smaller pulley temps are to high not to use
an intercooler but what this does is moves the power band lower in the revs giving more torque and more useable power

below is what intercooling does same motor same cam one is intercooled other is not notice the intercooled one falls over up top in the revs
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/uncooledvsintercooled.jpg

below is a heap of runs
blue -ve with a tvs1900
red- a 5L with 2.3L whipple but uncooled
yellow- my car whipple 2.4L intercooled
green- 383 stroker
white - ls1 with cam
purple - ls2 with cam
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww26/vnrockit/heapofpowerruns.jpg

we fitted the cams to the 2 vz's the rest were built else where

Im sure your calculator works fine on most cars but they never seemed to work for theses motors once they are intercooled
the mods we do arent new but we have refined them
cause of the torque and where it is makes it very easy to spin the wheels in 3rd on wet grass

[astro]

The torque is tractive effort NM at the wheels from the roller bed. The torque figure will be affected by torque convertor, diff gears, tyre sizes etc. I do all dyno runs in 3rd or 4th gear if manual, Its good for comparing car to car. Not what torque is delivered at the motor. An Auto is always going to have higher torque figure because the convertor multiplies it. But above graph shows different engine combos.

Who ever thinks its bs, welcome to come get a dyno run of their own car and see how it stacks up my number is 0438 944 648, we are there afterhours so suits a lot of people...

Its a new awd600 mainline dyno with all the traction modules, we can tune cars to 1200rwhp.

Danwa let me know what this pattern is please? We build mostly super6 auto's so of course torque figures are going to be the similar. I got graphs from rb25's and sr20s and the torque curves are pretty low in comparison to the v6. My car ran 10.98 400m with only 400rwhp, its a unopened stock standard l67 with a whipple setup.

[Turbo2.6L]

et's dont lie! nice time.

mph doesn't lie, et's are not consistant enough to relate directly to power.
Esky is right with his calculations, and yes they apply to all engines... Even the super6. Your engine is no different to any other when it comes to the laws of physics & simple maths calculations.
In summary, Esky's calculator & maths theory > idea that super6 engine is re-writing laws of physics.

Cool car in any case & hopefully it picks up a few mph with the new mods, taking you deeper into the 11's!

[astro]

lonewolf i assume thats diesel falls over at 4500rpm lol so assume thats why you have a high torque figure for an astra?

A vn we built it got done on that same dynapack dyno and read 316rwhp it made 290rwhp on our dyno.

[Turbo2.6L]

So you're saying this VN will have more power on a 'regular' dyno, thus more torque?
Low reading dyno is believable, torque figure is not :D

Comparing torque figures across different cars on different dynos is the same as comparing hp figures anyway. There is now way to do it accurately as there are waaayyyy too many variables that can/will effect results.

[Lonewolf]

lonewolf i assume thats diesel falls over at 4500rpm lol so assume thats why you have a high torque figure for an astra?

A vn we built it got done on that same dynapack dyno and read 316rwhp it made 290rwhp on our dyno.

My graph isnt torque at the motor (its at the axle), neither is the thread owners. this is the point.
When someone talks about torque (such as manufacturers), they talk about torque at the motor.
As stated above, torque at the wheels/hubs/roller are affected by many other factors, and hence arent comparable.

Its all a wank really, as long as the car goes hard, who cares?

[AGIT8D]

So you're saying this VN will have more power on a 'regular' dyno, thus more torque?

Mainlines always read HP lower (read: accurately).

[Turbo2.6L]

Bzzzt. Mainline settings can be altered, so they are as unreliable as any for this type of comparison. They are however useful for tuning & seeing gains/losses on a given car when strapped down & tinkered with on the same day/conditions as is any brand of dyno.
Mph is where it's at, cant be fudged & is only marginally swayed by 'outside' conditions in comparison to HP & torque figures.

[vnrockit]

Im not going to rip my motor out and put it on an engine dyno so you can compare with manufacturers power output who does that
we have a dyno to do our own r&d and tune cars, theses are the figures it puts out and we compare it with other cars we build to see what improvements
we make on the motors we specialize in
Not sure why your trying to argue that my car doesn't make 940nm @ the motor when i have said its at the wheels on a chassis dyno
im sure it will make less torque at the motor but there is a torque convertor in between the motor and the wheels
im happy with the gains it has made with this setup and have ripped it off already and put my tvs 1900 blower back on ready to tune again
or are you guys just trolling with a calculator

[Turbo2.6L]

You have been arguing that the torque figure is accurate for the last page, now you say it's only a good measure to see gains/losses in comparison to other setups you have had dynoed by this particular machine? Backpedal much??
Just enjoy your car & get it back down the drags to see what improvements in mph you have.

[vnrockit]

How am I back peddling all i did was put up 2 videos I didn't calculate that figure an 80k dyno less than a year old
Did then I'm being told that there's no way it makes that much torque @ the motor wtf

[esky]

Joe asked you if "torque" figure was tractive effort, you said no, "nope thats torque in nm"
Torque is measured at the engine or calculated back to it. Torque at the wheels is tractive effort and doesn't mean much.

The difference is huge, 940nm of torque is impressive. 940nm roller torque isn't.